Breaking News: ATR's already have jobs. We are teachers who work for the NYC school system.
The cost to the taxpayers for the Senior Adviser for Talent Management will be $185,298 per year. My understanding is he will have a staff in the ATR office. NYC Educator is cautiously optimistic about this new position. Chaz is more skeptical. I see it as comical. We don't need a Senior Adviser for Talent Management. We need someone to just place the Absent Teacher Reserves and end the program. It would be very easy to accomplish this task. I could do it for free.
This blog came up with a solution to this totally fake crisis that we proposed back before the latest UFT contract was settled in 2014.
We described the history of the Absent Teacher Reserve system, how the pool exploded under Mayor Bloomberg and we proposed a quick, easy answer.
We explained how right wing and neo-liberal, union haters want hiring and firing of teachers to be up to principals exclusively. This flies in the face of civil service laws which were put in place to cut down on what was massive government corruption back in the late 19th century. We also discussed seniority and unionism.
Seniority rights are a basic union principle. If the DOE wants to terminate a tenured teacher, they have to go through the legally mandated 3020A process, which still exists although it certainly is weaker under the new teacher evaluation law.
We also pointed out why Absent Teacher Reserves, who are usually senior teachers, are generally not hired for permanent positions in schools.
If a principal were to hire someone like me with twenty-eight years experience, I would take my rightful place on the school's seniority list and probably be one of the senior people in that school in the Social Studies Department. If that school then was downsized due to decreased enrollments or there was a budget cut (always a possibility), the Principal would be stuck with me and have to place into excess a newer teacher. I understand why principals would want to protect their junior people who will more than likely not be tenured and can be made to do whatever administration wants (for example pass every student) as opposed to someone like me who might have some problems with that.
Looking back, I predicted my own future. I have been an ATR-Provisional Teacher since Jamaica High School closed in June of 2014. Most of the time I have been at Middle College HS as a Provisional Teacher replacing someone who has been on Child Care Leave. If I am appointed permanently, I would become the senior teacher in the Social Studies Department and a junior teacher would then be put at risk if the school is downsized due to budget cuts (always a possibility). I don't blame the Principal, a wonderful human being and excellent administrator, for being reluctant to hire me permanently although we are trying to work something out. As of today, I'm still officially an ATR. A one year subsidy doesn't really help her much.
How can this fake problem be solved citywide? It's easy.
We had the answer back in 2014. Go back to a version of the system we used before Randi Weingarten and Joel Klein created this mess in the 2005 UFT contract. Let teachers teach where they want to. Here is what I proposed:
The best way to get the ATRs back in the classroom this fall would be to make hiring decisions for people from closing schools (and other ATRs) in a similar manner to the way it was done before the horrific 2005 contract. Back then teachers were given placement choices within the widest range possible by the Board of Education if a school was closed or reorganized (old Contractual Article 18G). Senior teachers were not seen as ogres who caused schools to shut down in those days (nor did we cost principals more on their annual budgets).
A teacher was given a wish-list of six schools and then was sent to one of them. Since some principals are reluctant to take veteran teachers in the current educational climate because we may talk too much, there would have to be a deal reached to influence some of them to accept ATRs.
The DOE should give ATRs the six school wish-list but instead of sticking ATRs on principals and making them pay on the school budget, the DOE should pay for ATRs centrally for their entire salary for as long as necessary (maybe up to a decade) when an ATR is placed in a school. A principal would not be charged a dime from the school's budget. There would be no extra charge for the city taxpayers either as it's just a matter of paying for people on a central budget-line as opposed to a school budget-line. Any subsequent downsizing caused by budget cuts or declining enrollments would be neutralized by this real subsidy. ATR's could be used to lower class sizes and guidance caseloads, a not so novel idea.
Under this plan, no ATR who had an ounce of sense would apply for a school that had a vicious anti-teacher principal unless they didn't do homework on schools. (Yes I know principal turnover is high but at least ATRs could start out at places where they want to be.)
The 2011 policy, still in effect, of forcing ATRs go to a different school every week as highly compensated substitute teachers makes no sense and is a complete waste of resources.
Other proposed ATR solutions that keep provisional hiring going - a teacher stays at a school for a year and then can leave or be sent back to the ATR pool by a principal or yearly substitute rotations - will just keep a class of teachers going around from school to school for decades until the last ones retire. Why not just end it now?
If someone is so bad, document it and use the 3020A process. Principals could even make someone a co-teacher, as the ATR would not cost them any money, if they are seriously concerned about damage done to children by a specific ATR. Administrators would actually have more control than they have now as ATRs are sent weekly to different schools to cover classes and principals must accept a different set of ATRs each week.
Other proposed ATR solutions that keep provisional hiring going - a teacher stays at a school for a year and then can leave or be sent back to the ATR pool by a principal or yearly substitute rotations - will just keep a class of teachers going around from school to school for decades until the last ones retire. Why not just end it now?
If someone is so bad, document it and use the 3020A process. Principals could even make someone a co-teacher, as the ATR would not cost them any money, if they are seriously concerned about damage done to children by a specific ATR. Administrators would actually have more control than they have now as ATRs are sent weekly to different schools to cover classes and principals must accept a different set of ATRs each week.
Fast forward three years to 2017 and watch the city waste more money to hire a "Senior Adviser for Talent Management" and give him a staff to try to find jobs for people who are already working in the system.
Place the ATRs and save that $100 million as well as the millions that the ATR bureaucracy is costing the city taxpayers.
How about someone at the Daily News or somewhere else writing about how this new job is just adding to the out of control DOE bureaucracy? It is more money being spent on the school system that is not going to the classroom. Where is the press?
110 comments:
The real problem was Bloomberg/Klein. They are gone, so why are all their people still making decisions and keeping their terrible practices ( such as the ATR pool)? DeBlasio needs to take a close look at the people he has making school policy and keeping Bloomberg's legacy alive. Until he cleans house, class size will continue to skyrocket, administrative costs will continue to skyrocket, the ATR pool will continue to flourish, and student will continue to fail - no matter what grade or diploma they are gifted.
And the UFT does nothing about any of it, except take credit that everything would be worse except for it. True, but how about making things better for a change?
Do you think we will ever see seniority based transfers or travel hardship transfers again in a contract down the road?
no will never see seniorty transfers again.
proncipals would be in an uproar-- press would have a field day.
we would become an excuse for all the failures in schools" unwanted teachers teaching classes causes failing schools" etc
Hey Mulgrew-
Heres a great use of union dues, as opposed to blowing it the way you are accustomed to: Conduct an independent audit of the waste, mismanagement and fraud of the NYC DOE and how those dollars could be, but are not, making their way into schools budgets. It's criminal what goes on, and you might just regain some support from your members. Maybe.
If we tell the public how much waste there is, and how much funding does not get into the schools, yes we can make gains.
The first thing the papers will call for is the layoff of teachers, their high salaries, summers off,health benefits, pensions and retirement. Best to keep our relationship as being the fleas on the DOE dog's back. The students being the turds of course.
MR Asher, a very decent man, has a clause in his agreement where he may, at his sole discretion, return to his post as Principal of Brooklyn Tech after one year
Well played,Mr Asher and Godspeed My $ says he'll be baaaaaaaaack...
Well, if I had the choice of any 6 schools in the city, maybe...If not,prefer to rotate.
ATRS not wanting regular jobs gives us all a bad name.
Why do people want to rotate? Are you that afraid of teaching? Let's push for placement in decent places like teachers used to have.
Whats decent? You want to be locked in the same place with the worst students and abusive admin for a whole year? And tied to danielson?
I am a Brooklyn ATR living in Staten Island. I think its time I am allowed to go to Staten Island after almost 25 years.
After rotating, I see what goes on in the bulk of the schools. Complete chaos, students do whatever they want, no discipline code, cell phones all over. I also see how much the teachers in each school hates it. Why would I want to be trapped in a Jefferson, Erasmus, Prospect, Transit Tech for a whole year or more? I would prefer to go in, do the 3-4 weeks, and start fresh elsewhere. Yes, there are big problems being an ATR, no keys, no office, no computer, no place to put your stuff, FS, being called sub...But, I would rather that than being stuck and held to a ridiculous standard by asshole admins, and have to deal with the same asshole kids for 180 days. And i have a feeling any placement would be forced, so we would have no choice. What if you drive and you are put in some place where parking is a nightmare, like downtown Brooklyn, doing that every day? Or what if the principal is a real headhunter? How are you getting around that? Tons of reasons why one would rather rotate.
Agree with above, been a Brooklyn teacher my whole career, always lived in SI, nothing but good ratings and attendance, and all I hear is its principal autonomy, they can hire whoever they want, our way of transfer is the open market. I cant even get an interview. When will this change? And yes, most of these Brooklyn schools are awful.
Amen 8:56. These kids are horrible and we are judged by how well they do on exams. Ridiculous system. I wonder if calling them asshole kids is better than black shitheads. Hope I'm not censored but the kids are out of control with the cellphones and cursing and cutting class, drugs and on and on and on. They smell like they all just smoked 5 joints each when they walk in. The only solution is to get the f out of education before it ruins us. I might be already ruined but don't worry Obama and that idiot Lewis from Georgia have done such a great job helping the black and brown students. Not my terminology but obamas.
Pick 1 out of 6 schools for the entire year or rotate. Or rotate just in your own district. Only High school teachers are unfairly discriminated and have to transverse the entire borough. I prefer to pick my one out of six and stay for the year. If I can't do that rotate me daily or weekly. Monthly is cruel because we build up relationships and are yanked out.
The pick your own school would have to be citywide, not the borough you currently teach in. That would be the same problem. If you think the DOE is gonna give us that much latitude, I think you're nuts.
Before the 2005 contract, you picked six schools within your license area and you got one of them. Case closed. People didn't go crazy when schools closed for the most part because usually they ended up in decent schools. It went beyond the district. At Jamaica, we picked up two teachers from Eastern District in Brooklyn when it closed. We also received teachers from Jackson and later Springfield.
When you are in a good school, unless you work for a principal or AP from hell, it is still a job that is doable.
I am talking about permanent placement, none of this temporary nonsense. I agree with all of you on not being assigned to hellholes. I'll cite the old contractual language again in a future post or comment. I have to go down my basement to find the 1995 or 2000 contract.
Not city wide, your own district. I actually think absolutely nothing will change.
As for the latitude issue, that's why you have a union to mobilize and push for these things. We don't even try these days. Principal dictatorship has in many cases been a disaster for education. Let's prove that there needs to be a check on their power. The UFT and PTA used to be powerful checks. It wasn't perfect but it was better than what we have now.
First, i dont think we will have an option. If we do, choice citywide is everything. As said above, if im locked into a boro i dont want to be in, no purpose is served. And yes, considering what most schools are like, id rather not he tied up. Thats a reflection on the schools, not on me.
Lol @ 9:37. It's wonderful to read how you feel about the students in NYC. It's my opinion that Trump and Sessions and their buddies are fragile minded
men who NEED to be in charge in order to feel comfortable. Prior to the GREAT President Obama there have been presidents who have done nothing but tie the hands and feet of Brown and Black folks and then criticize brown and black folks for not running fast enough or carrying their fair weight. If black and brown students have intuitive. I believe they recognize a "shitty teacher" like
yourself the moment they walk inthe classroom. I have a suggestion to MAGA, America needs to actually try to get the best out of ALL citizens instead
of just giving a wink and a nod to a privilaged few because history has
shown us that these privileged few are dragging this country (which was stolen) to the back of the line. I hope you leave education since you believe you are being "ruined". Hopefully in your free time you can volunteer helping kids and their parents combat their opioid addiction. You should can also take a class on how black brown yellow and white americans contributed to MAGA. I adore all of the students I teach and though they have challenges, it's not unique to black/brown folks. Read your history book and then go buy a black history book so that you are better informed. The only thing your post said to me is that you earned a master's degree (hopefully) in education, you should not be allowed to teach black /brown students and that you don't know the complete history of how we got to this stage in America. I started with lol and that's how I will end...LOL
937 is right. I dont know where some of you teach, or maybe you have the thought that everybody is great, but these schools and students are awful. You say good morning, they say suck my dick. You say put your phone away, they say get off my dick. Faggot, nigga, hear it all day...
I didn't say its unique to black or brown students
I didn't say I was ruined but might be
And the rest of what you say only deserves my sympathy not a lol. This topic is very serious for a lol and just like you (I guess) I care about all my students and they deserve better from themselves, the teachers, the doe, the liberal government, and especially parents. With that being said I wish my students well and try everyday to change behavior, or are we not allowed to do that anymore. Good try trying to blame me and by suggesting the students recognize I am a shitty teacher says more about your own personal perceptions than reality. Good luck my friend. Like I said numerous time you can't argue with the ignorant acting but you can sure try to educate them. Facts are the facts about many of the kids behavior are horrible. Not sure what's wrong with stating facts but I guess you still can't analyze the behavior of black and brown students without being called a shitty teacher or even a racists by some. God Help Us All
I hear it all day but you can't tell the truth anymore because people with a possible limited intelligence will call you a shitty teacher or a racists. It's all about censoring us and making us afraid to speak the truth about how the kids are acting. I guess it's all about previous oppression that makes the kids act this way.
I know you didnt use the word unique, I used the word "unique". You believe the solution is to"get the f out before being ruined". Well be prepared have a passionate convo and/or listen to a different perspective when you post on a blog. You called the students
"assholes" "they smell like weed" etc but you take umbrage by the words
shitty teacher??Well then now you know how someone else can be offended by such horrible words. You are upset and/or think the term racist will be used on you? Well you introduced race into the discussion. You grouped all students into one
category. That's being prejudiced. I don't know you, just your words. Your words are offensive TO ME. I am LOL because I find your opinion laughable and typical of how some folks with stones in their eyes see things. It's not haha funny but smh lol sigh...this person teaches!!???! DAMN.
However I agree with one thing you
said...God help us all.
Schools with ants, roaches, you guys who are desperate to teach and get placed, you are asking for trouble.
I didn't call the students assholes another post did my confused friend. They do smell like weed and so does the school. Just stating the facts about my observations not my feelings. Just because a person introduces the ethnicity of the students who smell like weed cut classes roam the hallways curse out each other and the staff are given fake grades because the teachers don't want to be blamed for the failure shouldn't be an opportunity for someone to be called a racists. Not saying you did but the ignorant acting might use it as a reason. Enjoy your day off and don't you wonder what the great Dr. King would say about the behavior many of the black and brown students in the doe. Again not my terminology but the laughable great predident obama. He risked and eventually gave his life for this. The drugs, unemployment, out of wedlock births, high dropout rates, criminality, incarceration rates etc... I know I know learn the history of oppression but it's time to get on with it.
A few weeks ago somebody posted that they were bitten by a student. You were more concerned with the name he called the kid. Thats disgusting. Only the lowest of the low shod be assaulted at work, by a student no less. Some of you need to wake up. If thats what we went to college for, and go to work to get, yes, that is trash.
How about no rotation at all? Never.
So you expect the UFT to protect your right to rotate from troubled school to troubled school so you don't have to teach a regular class? Am I wrong?
I am trying to choose the lesser of 2 evils. When i started i didnt even know there was such a thing as an ATR. Im saying, until these schools start enforcing the discipline code which already exists, until the doe gets their act together, until it becomes sonewhat normal,safe and somewhat a real teaching job, not babysitting, gettting cursed and threatened and then told i cant fail anyone, yes, id rather rotate.
The doe can place us anytime and anywhere they want...who cares what we want? I too prefer the rotation, considering the options. I didnt do anything to put myself in this situation.
So I was right that you expect the UFT to protect your ability to rotate from school to school and not have a regular teaching job. No wonder why some people hate us. It reminds me of the days of the rubber room when teachers used to ask the UFT to delay their strong cases so they could avoid the classroom for as long as possible. You have a lot in common with the UFT leadership and most school administrators. They worked to get out of the regular classroom too. Congratulations to all of you. You have played the system well.
After a few days in a school, I see whats going on, and I say wow, can you imagine if I had to stay here for 180 days? If you area teacher who writes a lot of students up, and complains av=bout the problems in a school, you would be butting heads with admin forever. Thats why some want to get in and get out.
The difference between the ATRs, the administrators and the UFT leaders is the ATR's don't tell the everybody else what to do.
Do you know how many jobs I have applied for? You act like its up to me. I have tried and tried to get hired, actually hundreds of applications since becoming an ATR. I cant even get an interview. You are now blaming me? I have nothing but S my whole career.
If you are trying to find a regular job, you are not who I am talking about. It's the people here who want to rotate and don't want a regular position. They make us look bad.
Bloomberg would have given us a contract in 2009 with the retro if the UFT gave up the ATRs. Everybody knows it. ATRS admitting on this public forum they don't want a regular position is poison for us all. You guys do it on Chaz's blog too. You don't think DOE and UFT honchos read this.
So why havent they just placed us all? Could have years ago. Or how about doing what was said above, making schools more desirable, giving teachers the option where, enforcing the discipline code, stop teacher abuse...I am a BK ATR teacher living in SI, if I had the SI option I would take it tomorrow. And yes, applied about a million times.
You are casting a broad brush. Yes, I have applied...However, seeing what I see in schools, which is disgusting, no I dont want to be tied to lousy APs or disrespectful, disgusting, criminal students, who literally do whatever they want...And say, "I can do whatever I want, you cant stop me." No notebook, no pen, but they sure got that $800 phone, which they illegally use in school, all day, and that $220 pair of sneakers, several of them, and all they talk about is credit card scams...You wants to go there? Point is, when I started, I never knew about ATR or a rotation, this is a DOE invention, which could be stopped tomorrow morning. With that said, there needs to be a hell of a lot of fixing in this system, just look at the teacher resignation rate in the first 5 years.
Case in point, fix this shit first...
One of the most glaring issues dealing with the DOE is the "double standard" when disciplining teachers and administrators. Teachers who commit or allegedly committed minor infractions can and usually are removed from the school and subject to 3020-a termination charges. By contrast, school administrators are presumed to be innocent and few are removed from their school. A case in point is the story of 33 year old Assistant Principal Diana Rendon of Progressive High School for Professional Careers in Brooklyn, who was first caught on a cellphone apparently boozing it up on a hotel bed with some of her teachers at taxpayers expense and now she has been accused of barging into a boys locker room with some of the boys still in their underwear.
Can you imagine if a male coach walks into a girls locker room with half-dressed girls? That coach would be immediately removed from the school, be subject to an SCI investigation, and quite likely suspended without pay for sexual misconduct and terminated.in a 3020-a hearing. Yet Ms. Rendon is still an administrator in the school. As a coach of a girls soccer team, I knew better if I wanted to keep my job and always had a female team captain handle the locker room and only came in when she gave me the go-ahead to enter. Yet, apparently Ms. Rendon rather than follow the rules, believes she can do as she pleases and barge in for any reason whatsoever.
Maybe the reason the DOE did not remove Ms. Rendon is that she is such a great administrator that she achieves academic excellence from the students and that's why she is still at the school? Well, no. The school has a graduation rate of 72% and only 9% are "college ready". That's right the school is another diploma mill high school with most of the students who graduate unprepared for the adult world and relegated to low wage jobs. You can see the information in the school's snapshot. Moreover, the teacher turnover is almost 50% at the school and that does not bode well for the school's administration and for student academic achievement. Finally, isn't fraternizing in a hotel room and on a bed with subordinate staff considered conduct unbecoming an educator? I guess the DOE does not think so.even if most of us do
What we have here is apparently another case of DOE's disciplining teachers and administrators, or the old "double standard".
You are totally correct but my point is that when teachers say they don't want a regular teaching job, it makes us look terrible and this is a public forum. Anyone with a phone can read it.
Well, maybe we should shine some light on how bad it is, and how billions of dollars are getting flushed down the toilet, and how 19 year olds cant even write a sentence, and how they are more concerned about gangs and crime.
I agree with you.
I think the teacher abuse by students, and the fact that students do absolutely nothing, cant read or write, and get free credits, are the biggest stories.
I have seen many ATRs who should be fired. Tons of lates and absences, really taking advantage. And some of these schools dont even bother to mark them late, which bothers me since I am there every day, and every day on time. Thats another issue that bothers me. Why am i getting a FS when ive done nothing wrong, and others are allowed to get away with murder. Previous U ratings, attendance problems, fines, charges, etc.
937 has:
1. Called students "black shitheads"
2. Said they all "smell like marijuana"
3. Insulted John Lewis
4.Believes it's "time to get on with" the topic of "oppression" and then smuggly thinks she/he will be painted as a racist.
Well the initial discussion was about the status of ATRs and the stress teaching in the schools. Now, 937 has moved on to incarceration rates, etc
I don't have enough time to discuss the raping, killing, stealing,
harassing vitriol hatred and blind ignorance in the bedrock of some
folks. I will say that while there are students and schools that are challenging--please know that there are students in these schools who do not curse and/or smoke marijuana. Review your posts and see how someone can take offense.
You need help. You shouldn't work near black/brown/yellow/white children because you are an uneducated person. All those negatives you spewed are just that--negative aspects of a community. I can spew twice as many positives but it would be a waste of my time. I am not impressed by your negative diatribe because I know history--US and global. Enjoy your day off and don't forget to thank the late Dr. MLK.
Also 937...I think everyone should be proud of the accomplishments of many students. We ALL should be proud of the hard work and success stories made since the murder of MLK. There are many students who have graduated and gone on to much success. However, if you were to write your story about teaching the reader would assume that ALL students have no values/morals. History books have shown that some writers will do anything to hide the success of black/brown students. Go see the movie, Hidden Figures--case in point of how John Glenn would not go into space without black/brown WOMEN checking the numbers. I actually love this discussion because it is helpful and healthy.
I'm glad you love the discussion but the numbers of failures is overwhelming in schools I have taught in over my 21yrs. These kids are lost and the behavior is disgraceful. Yes we do have successes and the students who succeeded should be proud of the accomplishments but again the stats don't compute. Fake grades and college readiness stats as well as the drug abusers, unemployment, welfare, criminality, incarceration and deplorable behavior I believe would not make Dr. King proud. I'm not sure where you teach but when students have money for phones cloths sneakers and weed but can't find the time or money to buy school supplies and treat each other with human decientcey is saddening. If I truly didn't care I wouldn't be having this conversation with you. The cycle of govt dependency and single parent homes must be discouraged and personal responsibility must be reinforced. A lot a blame to go around but people must adhere to the ask not what your country/govt can do for you but ask what I can do for my country.
When you walk into work tomorrow and every other word you hear is "nigga" you should remind students not to sat that, they are embarrassing Dr. King. And when you see the students underwear, and when they tell you to suck their dick, get off their dick, and tell us we cant tell them we cant tell the to put away their phones because we didnt pay for it, although we really did, but if we said they leech off the govt, that would be a racist comment. No, not all students in these schools are lousy, but more are lousy than not. These students are doing it to themselves. Of course there is some racism. However, the crime rates, lack of education, lack of common sense, high teen pregnancy, high disrespect, high STD rates, calling for dead cops...Yeah, blame the teacher. And they really have no issue having 4-5 kids by 25 years old, with no fathers, and no job and no education because the taxpayers foot the bill.
3:13 I never called the students black shitheads you need a refresher class in reading comprehension. Someone else did and enjoy your day off and thank the great United States of America.
What's FS?? Seen it twice in this thread.
Field supervisor
To 3:13 and they do smell like weed and smoke weed in the school. Am I not suppose to mention my observations? The Lewis comment speaks for itself. God Bless
Come on guys, its well known they smoke in and out of the schools. And any SSA will tell you they bring in tons of weapons. Its disgusting to be around most of these "students." By the way, most discrimnated against are Jews. And its almost zero precent in terms of cops shooting blacks...and in just about all cases, black is already a previous criminal.
These students walk into the schools thinking and knowing they run the place. Its sickening.
Careful...your getting personal. I didn't mention your misspelling several words nor your seeming inability to stay on topic (i.e. your out of nowhere attack on John Lewis). You mentioned teachers giving students passing grades and students not being college ready. Where the hell is the "personal responsibility" of folks who bow down to this pressure instead of running to the newspaper and/or working together as a single community to say NO to this damaging practice? There are serious social issues in a lot of poor communities however you better believe if we ALL do not work together to put an end to social promotion, it will cost EVERYONE in the long run. Look at the heroin problem in the suburbs. Heroin was a huge problem in the inner city many years ago and the user and seller were criminalized. It's an epidemic in the suburbs and now "we must not demonize the user" because they are sick. What happens in the inner city will make its way to other areas of the country, believe that. When you have meth labs exploding outside of the city, kids cheating, lying, shooting up elementary schools and churches and getting jobs not based on their skills or qualifications but because they are privileged to have familial connections or whatever, we will NEVER truly see how Great America can be because it's easier to give shit to someone and then look back and say "they smell like shit"... i won't tell you to try and stay on the topic "paying someone to work on the ATR pool" because I know people struggle staying on task. Yes, President Obama helped make America great and I am loving having this day off.
Using your logic, previous criminals do not deserve a trial. As we all should know by now, there are racists who are in the classroom, wearing a police
uniform,etc. The sad part is that the wealthy could care less about you. Some of you, your parents and grandparents have been fighting these "poor, ignorant, welfare moms" for generations for decades while the rich laugh at your struggle. Why are you "slumming" in these schools? The suburbs don't want you? Just know even when these "thugs, weed heads, etc" don't graduate high school or receive a poor education, they are strong survivors who will still press on...expensive sneakers and all. BOOP
They will press on thanks to the taxpayer, who pays for everything they have, including teenage childbirth.
Except i dont commit crimes, badmouth and threaten teachers, depend on welfare, ive never been arrested...
If you cant write a proper sentence at 20 years old, not stupid? They play the system because they are thugs, who know the doe is too pussy to throw them out.
Ok my friend good luck and work on that comprehension thing. Not personal but before you give credit to a statement make sure your correct. Only a few more days until the man who did nothing is out of office. Thank God and thanks for the looking out for my spelling and staying on task.
You live off the taxpayers and boast about not having to do much. Seems you are a middle class welfare recipient. Bond with the kids. You have loads in common.
Based on what I'm reading, I now know if a student says a teacher is a racist there is a real possibility it's true. Some folks need to leave teaching for the strong. What kind of person stays at a job for 21 years and hates it? Hates the environment! Hates the students! Hates the admin! Just hates everything but complains complains and complains. I know what kind of person...
Now who is getting personal. Keeping defending and enabling them my friend.
Thats really low, compare Atrs who have done nothing wrong to the total opposite. Really, the days of thinking "they are really good kids" are long gone.
Talking facts doesnt make one racist. Change behavior, then people wont be able to say these things.
You admit you don't want to teach a regular class. You are playing games with the system just like those kids you describe. You might be a bit more polished, but you are sponging off the taxpayers just like the kids you hate.
A teacher,with a good record, with BA and MA, whose school closed, is like a 20 year old freshman with 37 arrests?
What kind of person can't understand the reality of smelling like weed cursing out staff fake grades criminal records roaming the halls high unemployment welfare and drug abuse rates. I'm just stating the facts and not complaining. I don't hate my job but do hate the behavior of the kids you enable but I'm just an old veteran who feels sorry for the path our country is going down. Good try my friend about the racist remark. Only a few more until Obama is gone. Thank God
Come on James your going to let people bismerch the character of Atrs. Teachers who taught for years in a school that's was closed because many kids refused to go to class like mine smoked weed in the halls like mine roamed the halls like mine. The doe blamed the teachers in these schools and now teachers are blaming teachers. Yes I'm an atr and I would love to teach in a school again but the system is all fucked up. Bad behaving kids bad admins bad evaluation system bad everything. It's a jungle in the doe and I'm just trying to survive and if the means rotating so be it. Don't look down on me don't judge me I'm just trying to avoid being unfairly targeted by the horrible system. If you were an atr would you want to be sent to the numerous bad schools and have a horrible admin give you ineffectives because they can and will. Or sent to a school where the kids do all those unproductive things and get ineffective because only 30% passed the regents. Come on my fellow teachers wake up!!!!
I have no problem with what you are saying 6:12. Don't know what you want me to do on comments. Many comments here are people venting. It goes with the territory.
You could have defended the teachers that would like to continue the rotation system instead of being placed and site the reasons I gave. You know what's going on and more teachers need to defend Atrs who have experienced the horrible educational complexes where the shit has already hit the fan. Us Atrs have seen the shit conditions and are smart enough to side with rotations instead of placement. Come on my fellow teachers who have insulted us Atrs and called/compared to welfare receipiants. If you have seen, if you experienced what we have you would realize that we are taking a Hugh risk in being placed. Imagine getting placed in campus magnet, john Bowne, flushing, August Martin, Far Rock, beach channel and on and on and on. Your career would be in serve jeopardy. These schools end careers. I guess it's thecsame in the Bronx and Brooklyn. Ask me any question you want about why I don't want to take the chance of being forced placed. Like you we have many bills and have over 20yrs and over 45. You have know idea what these schools are like and it might come as no surprise they have many openings for teachers. I wonder why. Thanks for reading. Almost forgot Martin Van Buren. Lol
Okay buddy...we all agree that you really are a racist and not even a bright one.You spew "facts" that you probably got on the train ride home or at the local watering hole. Unfortunately the great President Obama will be leaving and the Russian puppet...i mean the reality show host...i mean donny will be in office. Remember, there will be another election in four years so let's enjoy the reality show. By the way I hope he takes care of the teachers but from the look of things he just don't give a damn about unions, teachers and oh yeah you poor suckers who "will vote for me even if i shoot stand in the middle of the street and shoot a gun"...lmbo donny really knows his market. I wish you were still in the classroom and not roaming because maybe you would be able to teach me how to comprehend. You said you've been teaching for 21 years? You were probably my teacher who passed me so that you could appease your principal. You see it's your fault that my comprehension is so poor old pal...oh well in the words of a wonderful R&B group...float on.
To 8:33- I do not favor forced placement.I want to fight for the pre-2005 contract system where teachers had a hand, a big say, in where they were placed when schools closed.I have no problem defending ATRS but I would like preferred placement as the solution rather than proposing a time limit to stay as an ATR or be terminated.
12 years of this system is enough. It can't go on forever.
8:33 here. I agree james and thanks for letting us vent about this horrible system
Maybe those pot head stupid students whose parents are on welfare are thinking about how the founders of America got free labor for a long,long time and they are going to chill for a moment and stick it to the man. Just a thought.
Good luck my friend and thanks for the name calling. I'm glad you had the opportunity to show your true colors. No pun intended!
Agree
937 started using terrible terms to describe students period. Read the 9:37 post and the prior posts. 9:37 mentioned John Lewis, questioned my comprehension skills,etc. I hope this person isn't an educator because if he or she is, heaven help the students. 9:37 gives ATRs a bad name. I can hold my own in front of and behind a screen but some students cannot. Some folks on this blog are crying for James to hop on their bandwagon because it seems like folks are speaking negatively about ATRS but these same people aren't speaking up about generalizations concerning students--unless everyone believes ALL students are drugged up welfare recipients. Don't call for James put on your big girl/boy panties and defend your stance even if you have to stand alone. If you can't take it don't dish it...friend
Just because you say it/write it (2:20) doesn't make it a fact. There are ATRs who come in late, are absent and are deathly afraid of a permanent position because of the "thugs, welfare recipients, yada yada yada". I would be wrong if i said ALL ATRs are lazy, shiftles, unemployable, parasites who really don't want to earn their pay. This is what happens when generalizations occur, feelings get riled. Take your medicine like an adult.
Resign now cause all of those stipulations you listed ain't that's right AINTgoing to happen. So just go ahead and quit. You don't like your job anyway. Quit Quit Quit. You know it all, I'm sure some big private school or better school with better kids will hire you in a heart beat. Quit...good luck in retirement. Turn the lights out on your way out and lock the door friend.
So have I 12:25
They are probably the descendents of the indians whose land was stolen or of those slaves who provided free labor for the lazy people who couldn't even nurse their own babies and used a "wet nurse". Not that, that's lazy.
Yes the Lewis comment tells me that you know not what he's done for US. Donny said all kind of sh## about President Obama but got on Twitter when someone questions the legitimacy of his presidency...typical double standard and everyone should pretend it's normal. Donnie and the reality show are as authentic as his wife's speech...puhlese. You probably smoke weed too. Lol..I am not impressed by you nor your observations.
Be the change you hope to see...you're an adult so model how one should change their behavior. You can start by not generalizing.
Back at ya pal!!! Pun intended
Exactly 550pm
How do you know if an ATR has or hasn't done anything wrong? Do you have the records of all ATRs or are you using that generalization logic again?
Keep being racist and ignorant floater.
God bless my angry friend
And at the end of all this our students are still acting horrible doing drugs getting fake grades roaming the halls telling each other to suck a body part on welfare commiting crimes and all the other unproductive behavior. You cant argue with the ignorant. Nothing every changes. Good luck my friend and thanks for interesting an unproductive conversation.
Another day in far rock. Already many kids smelling like weed roaming the halls and calling each other my nig and suck my dick. Not all my friend but many. Told 3 girl students to go to class they told me to shut up they had to finish a story about a sexual experience. And it's only 8:15.
ATRS who don't want to teach a regular class have something in common with students you hate. You are both playing the system.
Part of me is amazed by all the bigotry and hate, part of isn't.
When I was excesses from Murry Bergtraum a few years ago, I was sad that I'd be leaving friends I've made and kids I loved working with. Though I was better off because that school was becoming awful.
A year later I was at Art and Tech. Again made some friends and enjoyed working with kids. Horrible admin.
Academy for Social Action was last year. Awful, just plain awful.
This year I've been rotating and its re inspired me, I've visited good schools, worked with great kids. It's the best thing that's ever happened to me. I love teaching, but if given the choice between teaching in a bad school and being an ATR I'm going with being an ATR.
The kids are the kids. Even if they have lots of challenges, I don't mind working with them if the admin and staff are on the same page.
Personally though Obama was awful for education and Trump will be no better. It's disappointing because Obama had a golden opportunity to change education and he chose instead to bow to corporate greed. Had he done a better job, Trump wouldn't have become president.
Highly...I agree with you. I too recognize all of the challenges educators encounter in and out of the classroom. I will never stand by silently while an adult verbally berates children. I call it like I see it--black shitheads, idiot Lewis, etc demands a response from me.
You should have stayed home. Send your resume out to Stuyvesant, Bronx Science, L.I., Duchess County anywhere. Don't you think you can get a job with your experience?
You think that day didn't happen like that in Far Rock. Guy supposed to just sit back and take it? I might not like how he refers to the students but he has some good points about lack of discipline and disrespect for teachers.
Will you stand idly by when kids berate teachers?
Yes there is lack of discipline, no or little respect for teachers and bullying administrators which is sickening. So lets stick that without saying "black shitheads" or belittling John Lewis. I mean how do you complain about being disrespected and insulted but you turn around and do the same thing? It's ludicrous. Be the change...
Never! I treat ALL people with respect. I try not to prejudge. I have many poor students who live not in the best environment but they come to school daily and EXPECT to get a good education so they can get to college and hopefully move from their environment. Everyone is failing them--parents, community, peers etc. Now some educator thinks it's okay to call them "black shitheads"? Not on my watch.
Fake news
Would have been better to just say shitheads. No need to attach race to it. We can all figure out what you mean.
And more fake news
Yes@9:52 Stevie wonder can see/feel how folks feel about NYC students.
I love Stevie Wonder. Thanks my friends enjoyed our chat. Have a great second half of the school year.
You too
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