Friday, August 19, 2022

JOHN LIU THINKS GOVERNOR HOCHUL WILL SOON SIGN THE BILL TO LOWER CLASS SIZES IN NYC

Camille and I attended the John Liu education town hall at the Flushing Public Library on Wednesday evening. Camille signed up to speak but we spent the beginning of the meeting looking for a parking space and then catching up with our friend Sam Lazarus so since we were late, she didn't get a chance even though she signed up. No big deal as there were United for Change activists who did speak including Norm Scott, Jia Lee, and Christina Gavin.

The topics of the town hall were the class size bill that overwhelmingly passed the State Assembly and Senate but still has not been signed by Governor Kathy Hochul and the budget cuts to New York City schools. Liu explained how the state is not cutting the money that was sent to the city schools. A couple of speakers did question the Senator on the renewal of mayoral control of the schools and the high school admission process that shuts so many students out of any of their choices. Students with disabilities not receiving mandated services was also raised.

The real news made at the meeting was when Liu said that he believed the Governor would soon sign the class size reduction bill. He noted how it passed the Senate by a vote of  59-4 and 147-2 in the State Assembly. Liu emphasized that courts had mandated lower class sizes so students in New York City could receive their sound basic education as required by the New York State Constitution.

Ever the skeptic, I will believe the law is going through when Hochul actually signs it (or the Legislature has the guts to override a pocket veto with their veto-proof margins). Even if lower class sizes in NYC become law, I won't be convinced this is real until class sizes are finally reduced to 20 (K-3), 23 (4-8), and 25 (HS) in every classroom in New York City except for phys ed and performing arts. (Many classs with students with disabilities should be even lower under current law.) I will concede that Hochul's signature would be a big step forward. 

In case you are wondering, the official UFT did have a small presence at the town hall Wednesday evening. 

208 comments:

1 – 200 of 208   Newer›   Newest»
Anonymous said...

Who cares. The students really earn that diploma.

https://medium.com/@newyorkteacher/guessing-c-for-every-answer-is-now-enough-to-pass-the-new-york-state-algebra-exam-93bac55b3e24

Anonymous said...

I was speaking with a teacher over at the summer school program and the desks/chairs in her room barely fit. I don't know what she does during exams, and I can't imagine having to teach in that environment. One of my most effective classroom management techniques is circulating the room with a pad and pen looking down, taking notes. I'll even sit down next to a loud group and spoil their little party. They'll get to working right away, lol. Her room is so tight I know she can't circulate the room. On the other hand we're very lucky in that for the most part, our classes are just not that large. I don't know how they're able to swing it, and other schools have classes that are 30+.

Anonymous said...

Leonie Haimson

ICYMI: Sen. John Liu explains why smaller classes are essential to provide NYC students with their right to a sound basic education according to NY's highest court

https://vimeo.com/740940510

Dawkins said...

I agree that I won't be convinced until I see 23 kids in front of me.
Until then, if it is signed, I expect my chapter leader to be making the rounds to our 30 or so classrooms asking everyone to sign off on an ineffective grievance of some kind.
Hoping for the best.

Anonymous said...

Class size is just one thing, one failure the city and DOE hold others accountable for (its consequences) and not themselves. Same with time constraints and insane conditions for admin and scoring of Regents exams, not to mention failure to allow teachers to appropriately prepare and a host of other related failure and all of the consequences of this. It is all like a great grand gallery walk of reasons why everyone in the DOE needs to be out.

Anonymous said...

Class size has been and is low in my home town. Shame that the political party that’s ruled ny for decades doesn’t give a shit about city kids. Not surprised considering the elite private schools never closed. The ruling class sees peasants when they look at nyc working class.

Anonymous said...

So you complain about tin foil hats and non reputable sources. Would the fbi crime stats be reputable? Or you just want to censor things that offend people like you?

Anonymous said...

Dumb question-Why do we rank so low educationally in the world?

waitingforsupport said...

Agree @ 3:28 pm. It's one thing. Let's see if folks who are serious about students rip the bandage off the biggest thing: Grade fraud. No one is touching THAT thing. Class size should've been lowered years ago.

Anonymous said...

I don’t care. I just want more money. I will do my best as always. But that’s what we should be fighting for

James Eterno said...

When we are writing g about crime, you are m9re than welcome to cite FBI stats.

When we are talking school budget cuts and lower class size, FBI stats are way off topic and won't enhance the conversation. Move on please.

Anonymous said...

Because of people like 10:03.

Anonymous said...

Another winner. So glad we have the strongest union in the country to help us.

The NYC DOE removed Oneatha Swinton as principal. but kept her on the payroll at $187K despite an insurance fraud rap, and findings that she improperly paid $100,000 to a vendor pal, and failed to safeguard 600 computers, printers and laptops--all missing.

https://t.co/vWEcRXAmPR

Jeff said...

With all due respect, I posted several weeks ago. I said that I had repeatedly emailed Banks. James got the same email. I was repeatedly ignored.

I am in the office of my AP and principal, as well as in their email, begging to find out how a student who never attends class did the work and met the standards.

My CL knows.

The DR knows, who told me to tell Janella.

Solidarity was also copied on the emails.

Anonymous said...

Actually, I don’t think grade fraud is the biggest thing. The biggest thing, in my view, is misunderstanding what education really should be, and it has precious little to do with testing and grades. Do we really grow and develop through taking in information and ‘proper’ ideas? In this Information Age, what’s the exact point of that? People need to know how to cope, how to live and how to think, roughly in that order. If the information and ideas brought in to do that sticks, deeply informs, guides, motivates, inspires, then all the better. But people as they develop are all over the place at different. Some may find a calling very early and become very academically educated as needed. Others, maybe not so much, not in the same way; not in such a strictly academic sense perhaps. I think the education bureaucracies, pro-testing corps and global competition wonks and worriers have it all completely backwards. There. Well, that’s my rant for the day. Thanks for reading. I’ll retire this posting time.

Anonymous said...

At least Mulgrew is negotiating for us.

Want to own a car? That will cost you 11% more than last year.

Want to fly on a plane? That will cost you 23% more than last year.

Want to stay in a hotel? That will cost you nearly 40% more than last year.

Anonymous said...

23 days till contract expires

Anonymous said...

No contract.
No idea about teachers choice.
So glad this is a pro union blog.
I almost can ignore every single daily complaint.

Anonymous said...

Not because the students?

Anonymous said...

“Until we require the Department of Education to use the state funding properly and get class sizes within a range that is acceptable under the state constitution, we’ll still be in this same situation [of overcrowding],” Liu said. “As much as some schools or classes may be more ‘popular’ than others, that’s no excuse for continuing the endless cycle of excessively large overcrowded class sizes without any plan to finally reduce them.”

https://qns.com/2022/08/senator-liu-town-hall-education/

Anonymous said...

I don’t understand why everyone bitches for funding when $38B in one year got us illiterates graduating high school and no shows passing classes.

Anonymous said...

LOL. James wrote that uft has a small presence at town hall. Is that a joke? Millions of dollars in dues...for that?

Anonymous said...

Contract-raises need to be at least 10% increase or 3% and no more extended day.
Increase in teachers choice
Payment for using OUR personal phone for code to access email
additional sick/personal time-long island get 15-12 days a year we need more

Federal/state funds need to go DIRECTLY to the school buildings
NO cuts to teachers take it from the office people who DON'T TEACH and who didn't have to be less than 6 feet apart in unventilated stairwells

Someone would have to be crazy to go into teaching today-you can do many other higher paying jobs from home, hybrid and not be under a microscope or put your health at risk

and not be given the job of crisis counselor, dyslexia dignoser and teacher. 3 jobs which should be SEPARATE

UFT WHERE ARE YOU IN THIS?

Anonymous said...

James, rethinking the wonderful uft?

Anonymous said...

Sounds like an upstanding group of people.

Anonymous said...

Not a chance on any of those, but pay dues and hope.

J said...

This is the example of why the city should cut as much budget as possible.

These are 2 summer school students who are not graduating because of me. As you read the writing ability, please ask yourself how they got the other 43 credits.

By the way, they almost never attended summer school and did less than 10% of the work...But it's my fault.

Names redacted/changed of course...

Student 1
"Good afternoon mr x, I do not have this subject in the classroom anymore, I saw it this morning when I was trying to get in the meeting" (This was after summer school had ended)

"But mr , I couldn’t complete the last assignment, can I do something extra to earn the credits? Please let me know, those were my two last subject to graduate and I have two jobs and can’t loss this graduation."

"I though the assignments in the google classroom were the videos on the meeting, why using two platform instead of one?
I had my problem in the edmentum site because I just saw two assignments the one the I did and 1 missing.
I very confused right now and surprised. Do you think I can work on something extra. Please Mr my counselor can explain you on everything I been going through for almost a year. I just want to finish high school."
(Student was missing almost all assignments)

Student 2
(This is July 28, summer school started July 5)
Hi is emily I was having trouble with the nycstudents email the school told me to log in to google classroom with my old email so I usually connect to the zoom meeting but I don’t think you mark me present o I just let you know and also want know how to do your homework? Where can I find them?

After spending time going back and forth via email helping studnet, a month, late, get into remote class...
It worked. Thanks.. now what I have to do?

Then, after summer school is over...
Hi Mr. it’s emily I here I can’t graduate because I got 55 for your class and I don’t understand cause I do all your work
(She did all her work, one out of 16 assignments)

After the regents, i continue to get emailed...
Hi Mr I can’t gradue just for your class it will not fair to do a semester again just for your class.. can you make it 65 instead of 55

LOL. I should just "Make it" a 65.






Anonymous said...

I have a question for you, What good will it do to have emily sit there for another semester in high school? Please you are standing up to the system, but what good is it going to do her?

Anonymous said...

Did emily pass the Regents?

Anonymous said...

Sne her to me and I will happily edit her emails if she passed the Regents.

J said...

12:55,

What good is high school in the first place?

Should anyone fail? What is the cutoff?

Do you think either of these students are career or college ready as Mr. Banks demands?

Can they hold a job with no work ethic?

They don't even bother to show up.

They are reading and writing on a 2nd grade level.

Why are we bothered with observations, lesson plans, scaffolding, improvong instruction, PD, etc...If nothing counts and these clearly undeserving students can pass?

Also, what does it say to the students who actually attend?

J said...

Passed the Regents? Nobody passed. They all got waivers over the last 2 years.

We have tons of students who got 30s on the Regents, then got 5 waivers because people passed them without merit.

Anonymous said...

One of those kids clearly can hold a job. Read his own words, " I have two jobs..."

You still aren't answering the question on what good it is doing to have these kids come back next term.

Anonymous said...

The principal should just use his/her discretionary credits or give some independent study bullshit to move these kids on and let Mr. J keep his hard-won integrity especially if they passed all of their Regents exams.

I do agree that we have to reintroduce standards but they have to be evenly applied. The graduation rate would then plummet.

Anonymous said...

I'm talking about full time with benefits, ya know, like teachers have...

Because they don't deserve the credit.

You didn't answer my question...Who shoud fail? If not them, then who?

Anonymous said...

1:01 in her email she says that the GC can explain everything thats been going on. Granted the last day of school is not the time for this conversation but did you ever find out what that was?

Different situation but I remember one year a student was LTA after nearly perfect attendance in prior years. Had passed all regents. I knew something happened. Come to find out his mother had passed. I decided to pass him then got nervous because of the absences. Shared it with AP and she had him as as student also and had passed him. The French teacher was furious that anyone suggested she reconsider. The senior couldn't graduate because of French. Power and control is how I saw it.

Anonymous said...

Lowering class would be great—no question about it. I’m more concerned from the news reports from places around the country that indicate teacher shortages—right now at the start of this new school year. When will teacher shortages actually occur in the NYC schools—its inevitable—and it won’t make a difference when it comes to the shrinking of class size. Also remember that there still about 100,000 students in NYC public schools— that still haven’t accounted for since the start of the pandemic.
In an added note, I heard that the NYCDOE is poised to hire Bi-Lingual teachers from Central America to conduct classes with the potential of hundreds of newly enrolled immigrant students that just arrived from Texas—and who knows how many more families will arrive in the upcoming weeks.

DD said...

I can't believe all of you are telling the teacher to pass them. Anyway, the regents has been nullified. I work in a transfer school in Manhattan. We had many, almost every trasncript I checked, who throughout many years of high school, failed every test by a millon miles.

All of a sudden...

WA
WA
WA
WA
WA

Graduation.

Oren said...

This board is a riot. Everyone says "GRADE FRAUD MUST STOP."

A guy tries to stop it and gets met with "Just pass them or I'll edit their emails or have the principal give a bullshit independent study"

No wonder we are universally laughed at and can't get a decent contract.

Anonymous said...

If they have two jobs, they certainly have some skill.

Anonymous said...

Fail them if you like. They earned it but what good is it going to do for them to be back next term?

Anonymous said...

Not enough skill to attend school or write a coherent sentence?

Did they do the work? According to J, not even close.

No attedance, no work done.

Where are the 65 points?

waitingforsupport said...

Yes Oren. I agree that we are laughed at and humiliated. Too many educators have folded. They've turned a blind eye to the fraud. The guy who has written and notified everyone about the fraud is doing the right thing. He's probably ostracized by his colleagues and administrators. Unfortunately his help won't come from his union reps (who are possibly sharing his concerns with admin--behind his back) Great question: Why hasn't ANY union official (elected or running) openly sounded the alarm on this fraud? And @ DD: You've presented the perfect example of a system in place to harm students and in turn this nation.

waitingforsupport said...

@122pm: hiring more teachers from other countries? Teachers in this country are grappling with among other things--student debt. We are really in a pickle.

Anonymous said...

1. So just pass everyone?

2. Would you want your kids, as in the ones you birthed, to get passed while having absolutely no knowledge?

3. Who is going to teach them remedial English?

4. The jobs they have wouldn’t be what you want for yourself. Are they going live off of Medicaid and welfare because they can’t get real full time jobs?

Anonymous said...

No..people are asking questions and every situation is different. He asked for input didn't he?

Anonymous said...

That kid can hold a job. Whether they have a diploma or not, he has skills. Gi e him a different kind of education.

waitingforsupport said...

@1255pm. Is this a trick question? Teachers have a job. Students have a job. Both must complete the requirements established. What lesson will "Emily" learn if the teacher "makes" the grade 65? 6 months isn't long. Hopefully she will learn the material as well as the fact that she EARNED the grade. That's something she will be proud of. I personally wouldn't give a student a grade. I respect them too much.

waitingforsupport said...

@1:08pm. What harm is it for them to come back next term? It's 6 months. One class is 45 min. If the class is needed to graduate and the student obviously recognizes this--make it happen.

waitingforsupport said...

@J: I wouldn't pass anyone if they haven't met the course requirements. Goodluck and continue doing what's best for students, the country and yourself.

Anonymous said...

So having that student sit in high school for six more months will teach them to straighten up? Not likely, they will just program her for a teacher guaranteed to pass her or put the kids on the APs class list. EZ pass. Meanwhile, you have put a blemish on the school's graduation rate.

Fail all the undeserving but this needs to be fixed systemically, not idividually to have any impact.

Anonymous said...

Well, that’s her punishment for not doing the work, not taking school seriously. If J is the first, good for him.

Anonymous said...

248 is saying to pass everyone. Pathetic.

Anonymous said...

Remember when students had to bring pen, pencil, paper? Even that is gone. Even for the regents, we had to give pen and pencil. NYCDOE is a joke. No education, no integrity.

Anonymous said...

I am just saying lone wolves cannot solve this. It requires a systemwide fix.

Anonymous said...

NYC DOE is a farce. Bloombucks made sure of that. He needed to create more profit for his cronies. So, he degraded public education with the goal of replacing public schools with charter schools.

Refresh your memory. Remember "Race to the Top" , Arne Duncan, Barack Obama. What the F*** did they do for the education of poor, African - American inner city kids? They were are all nothing burgers!

Anonymous said...

Yep

Anonymous said...

3:49 how does remembering that help us today? But you got in your Obama and that's what's important. Bravo

Anonymous said...

Make the doe work for you…not the other way around.

Nobody in this system cares! That’s cool! I can do my work, try my best and goo ok home and sleep well and collect 6 figures. Not bad!


Go work a real job with your high moral ground haha.

Anonymous said...

waitinforsupport is 100% correct that they have to earn the grade. And it's a systemic problem, but it is going to be up to individuals to fix it. My Principal is always, always, suggesting that students are passed. She'll always preface it by saying "let it not be said that I have dictated that students are passed". Uh, yeah, that's exactly what you're saying. Sometimes she'll have the AP send a note attaching the DOE guidelines about how attendance doesn't have to be taken into account. The teachers fail them anyway if they don't deserve it. Then of course we have to sit through the coercive scholarship meetings. If the students haven't attended, and haven't done the work, they'll fail. The DOE and Administration are going to do what they do and say what they say. We have to take it upon ourselves.

Even for selfish reasons. Students who pass without doing the work are going to be the worst behavior problems. Not in all the classes, but in the classes that let them get away with it. It's not entirely their fault, they have been conditioned throughout their entire time in NYC public schools to get passed along. By the time they get to high school they are in for a rude awakening. They make threats to go to the Principal, to tell their mothers, call 311. They know it all but none of that matters anymore. Not in our school anyway.

Anonymous said...

Guess who…

WANTED for ROBBERY: 8/12/22 approx. 3:30 PM, in front of 728 river Ave
@NYPD44PCT
Bronx. The suspects displayed a knife & took a 37 & 38-year-old male victim's property.

Anonymous said...

This is a true story involving test fraud:

Years ago, a math teacher held an end-term party in her house. Most of the math teachers were there. So was the AP. We were all “talking shop.” One of the teachers told a story about an incident which occurred over ten years prior, during the administration of a previous AP. A student who had failed the Math Regents Competency Test (RCT) twice in the past had taken it once again. This time, the student had failed with 38 questions correct out of 60, but needed 39 questions correct to pass. The teacher erased the pencil mark from one of the incorrect multiple-choice bubbles from the scan sheet and bubbled in the correct answer. At the time, no ink marks were required to be placed through the pencil marks. When the (previous) AP saw the test results, he said to her, “But I thought you told me __________ had failed again. What happened?” The teacher told us that she said to him, “Just don’t ask!” She then continued to the party guests, “__________ needed to pass the RCT in order to graduate. What good would it have done her to fail it for a third time? I did the right thing!” We all kept our mouths shut and didn’t report this “confession.”

Anonymous said...

Wow, Columbus, OH teachers have gone on strike.

Jennifer said...

Student grades are about much more than just passing an undeserving student or two. I am less concerned about the failing students and more so about the students passing the course. The “good” students see and are effected by schools and teachers that have no standards. When you pass an undeserving student, you are sending the message that you are not serious and neither is your course. You are sending the message that study, discipline and effort do not matter. You are perpetuating the entitlement attitude among students. Of course, teachers should be told if a student is facing extraordinary circumstances.

I understand that the doe is a joke and has no standards. I have lowered my standards to survive in the doe but I will not eliminate my standards.

Anonymous said...

With reps like these

https://t.co/wIgABYjhky

Anonymous said...

Its Obama's fault that New York squandered their $700M grant?

Anonymous said...

Top Pay at 130K
6th class at about 15K
Per Session 20K
Summer school 8K
173K
Thanks! Love reading this blog while the reality sets in of just how great this system is. We all know it's fake. So what! Headed to Costa Rica for duration. Enjoy my fellow friends and try not to take things to seriously.

Anonymous said...

Spoiler alert. At the town hall, Mulgrew Will thank himself for working hard, teachers Will thank him, he’ll say that they don’t negotiate contracts in public and he wants cuts restored. Nothing Will gone from this. The sheep will return, James will say we are pro union, we will not have an on time contract, we will get treated like shit.

Anonymous said...

Anybody have the phone for the town hall?

Anonymous said...

Hi 11:52AM, your comments about your imaginary life sound great except if what you say is true you wouldn't concern yourself with constantly coming on this blog to read and make comments.

Anonymous said...

I’d like to know what skills the kid with 2 jobs has. 2 jobs means he’s got the work ethic. If we were a real education system we’d know his skills and we’d know which employable skills he could potentially master. Is he a people person? Is he good at tinkering and fixing things. How’s his math skills. Can he keep his composure under pressure. Lots of skills to assess. But this system is so hell bent on bullshitting us with talk of useless college credits for everyone it ignores the kids who work their asses off earning money. Money probably for necessities not to go on spring break with his friends. Internships and mentoring instead of college is a more employable bet for many but it’s ignored. Gotta fund those universities instead of really giving a leg up to a kid with a work ethic. Neighbor is always bitching her 16 year old puts no effort into school. But the kid mows lawns, shovels snow and does other things to earn money. He’s a hustler in a good way. That should be celebrated. You’re not necessarily a loser because you fail inside a loser school system like nyc.

Anonymous said...

Ohio teachers vote to strike over class size and bldg conditions

Ohio teachers strike over class sizes, building conditions

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/ohio-teachers-strike-over-class-sizes-building-conditions-2022-08-22/

Anonymous said...

Another clairvoyant @1:09pm. You people crack me up. And by you people I mean kitten stranglers. I’m clairvoyant too.

Anonymous said...

4:10 Hush- grownups are talking, and there are bigger fish to fry.

Anonymous said...

1:09 ROFLMAO. You hit it right on the head. Imagine saying "so long, heading out, don't take it serious, heading to Costa Rica", and then still being here responding to your post and thinking about strangling kittens. WTF is that? It's like a bipolar personality.

Anonymous said...

I was just reading an article about a teacher's 9-step bathroom policy; she got called out for it on Reddit. Does anyone here have a bathroom policy that they use regularly? Bathroom log, or something else? If someone is asking to use the bathroom every day, do you allow them to go? Do you allow more than one at a time?

Anonymous said...

We’re not the same person. Shocker. More than one person thinks you’re an idiot @4:44

Anonymous said...

Guess what? If you stuck to relevant matters, you wouldn’t need to reply by time stamp! In fact, stop. Stop wasting time, distracting and burying anything that could actually help.

Anonymous said...

6:20, I'm not 1:09 so what are you talking about "more than one person"? You're the only one who responded to me just now. Must be bipolar kicking in again. I guess no Costa Rica for you fool.

Anonymous said...

@6:20 this sounds like you. Was it? "It has been the most profound experience of my life to watch people I thought were capable for critical thought line up to take the shots, and then shoot up their children, and then treat me like a lunatic without listening or looking into any of my objections.

Profound and devastating, but at least I know where I stand"

Anonymous said...

@8:09 who are you talking to? If you don't put a timestamp, nobody knows who you're responding to. Besides it's subjective whether something is relevant. 10:03 doesn't have a timestamp and I don't think it's relevant. 10:49 doesn't have a timestamp and they tried to do a little race baiting there. Scroll past the comments that you don't want to bother with.

Anonymous said...

YES! And over class size and bldg conditions!

Anonymous said...

Nobody is talking about the fact that Ohio teachers have just voted to strike over class size and bldg conditions.

Anonymous said...

Nope.

Anonymous said...

“The union says it was pushing for guaranteed air conditioning, "appropriate class sizes" and full-time art, music and physical education teachers in the city's elementary schools.”

https://www.npr.org/2022/08/22/1118789575/columbus-ohio-teachers-strike

waitingforsupport said...

@733 I agree. Students, educators, parents and citizens are conditioned. It is up to the individual to do what's right. I can live with "attendance NOT being a reason to fail" just as long as the student is meeting the course requirements. First do no harm: if a student has not shown to me and even the state that they know the material--they will fail. I stand by what i said that no one will put in writing that you must pass a failing student. They will suggest suggest and suggest. The academic policy is available to review. Students parents whomever can go to whomever they want to go to. I keep great records. If admin wants me to pass a failing student they will have to put it in writing. I will attach their email to my records.

waitingforsupport said...

@1:10am. You're lucky everyone kept their mouths shut. If one person at the party would have reported this "confession" to the right person, everyone and anyone at the party could have been called in to meet with investigators. Changing a grade is illegal illegal lol. I remember graders would give the benefit of the doubt for a grade but damn--changing a grade is lose your job illegal. I knew of a student who never scored higher than a 20 on the ELA RCT. She was reevaluated and assigned a scribe. Admin found the right sucker to sit with the student and voila--the student passed with an 89. The ATR AP was even stunned and brought it to several staff attention. Needless to say investigators were notified.

Anonymous said...

Because we won’t strike. Why discuss?

Anonymous said...

I’m away too. You can post on the blog from another state.

J said...

I’ll ask again, if no show and no work doesn’t fail, who and what does?

I am still getting emails from the two students. Summer ended August 11.

If they spent the time doing the work and/or attending instead of emailing after the fact and begging, they wouldn’t be in this position.

If they passed during the regular school year, they wouldn’t be in this position.

The only thing they are ready for would be the most basic, elementary level remedial classes.

How did they get the other 43 credits? Grade inflation/fraud?

They clearly didn’t meet the standard, even if I disregard attendance.

The excuses are just that. They were remote summer school classes. They had 24 hours per day to do the online work, even if they never attended my class. They were at home. Gimme a break.

Anonymous said...

8:36, well of course you can, but who would want to? It's one thing to check in on contract stuff, but to go on vacation to argue with anonymous people on a blog? Lol. That's just stupid.

Anonymous said...

8:26 you're right. I worked with a teacher that the APs did not like and she had horrible observations, but it seemed the Principal was afraid to take action lest she be accused of racism (the teacher was not black). Anyway, this teacher changed some grades on an exam, and it was obvious, and that was all they needed. She gave them the reason they needed and she was out.

Anonymous said...

J, some people have differing opinions, but some have said, no show, no work, they fail. Don't respond to the student emails, or just tell them any further discussion has to be with their guidance office. It may be too late now, but if it were me I would've called the parent and explained why they were failing. The student would have also received an email letting them know they were at risk of failing the class with a copy to Guidance. Not sure why you're concerning yourself with the other 43 credits. Obviously they failed something or they wouldn't have been in summer school. I didn't think their emails were horrendous. They were coherent and legible; maybe they were using their phones (my counselor can explain you on everything suggests they're an ESL student, maybe?).

Anonymous said...

Who on this blog would vote for a strike, and why or why not?

waitingforsupport said...

@jj... are you just rhetorically asking on this site?

Anonymous said...

Relevance

Anonymous said...

Alex Zimmerman
There are reasonable arguments about why individual schools should be funded based on the # of students they serve

But if the *district's* funding is flat or grows even as enrollment declines, Lander says the city could shrink class sizes or spend more $ on vulnerable kids

Anonymous said...

🤦‍♂️

J said...

Because I see constantly, in my school, students who never attend any classes and have no work ethic, gain all these credits. Just wanted to shed some more light on “education.”

I’m not changing the grades.

No work, no attendance, take some responsibility.

Anonymous said...

I work in a high school that has a park across the street. During class time, we can see dozens of students, in that park, chilling out, talking, smoking weed, etc. Students enter the building high. They are allowed to walk in and out as many times as they want during the schoolday. This happens everyday, every period. My school has horrile attendace. When I check report cards, I see the people who are in the park everyday, passing almost every class. I see people who have 20% attedance passing almost every class.

When I ask students to do something simple, like multiply a small number by 2, they can't.
Add, subtract, divide...Nope.

Write a pararaph without a million errors...Nope.

Yet the standards, in all these classes, are met, while hardly being present and not having basic skills.

Anonymous said...

4:22 It's the schools fault that they have no structures in place and the teacher's fault for passing them. Sounds like your school just gave up on things.

Anonymous said...

To Anonymous 4:22 P.M.:

This is going on because no one is regularly reporting it to the NYS Education Department and the media. If NYC teachers were to deluge the Commissioner of Education, Board of Regents, Albany media, and NYC media with complaints about what routinely occurs in DOE schools, we would see action rather than "business as usual." One year, our principal received a letter from some official at the NYS Education Department asking the principal to explain why there was a high percentage of Regents Exam grades in the 65 to 67 range and a low percentage of Regents Exam grades in the 62 to 64 range on the June Regents during the previous school year. The NYS Education Department was suspicious that this was not simply due to chance. There were also issues with missing initials of teachers on graded answer sheets and test booklets. So the principal passed the letter along to the AP of the subject, and asked that he draft a letter for the principal's signature. The AP, in turn, handed out copies of the letter at a Department Meeting, and asked that the teachers research the issues (without having the actual Regents papers in front of us) and come up with believable explanations. We did some "creative writing" and managed to get the NYS Education Department off the principal's back.

waitingforsupport said...

@5:51 pm. Precisely. Unfortunately many schools are doing this. It's intentional.

waitingforsupport said...

@5:56pm. The water trickled down to the classroom teachers and they mopped it up. I know one thing, the DOE will always protect principals. Why? The principals are making sure teachers are issuing fake grades. Now if the sh*t hits the fan--you will be left holding the bag ALONE.

Dawkins said...

J--
I admire your integrity and hope you continue to stand strong.
I have done the same but not to your level.
Be true to yourself while covering yourself.
Let others give up and be less than you.

Anonymous said...

Why have all the standards been abandoned?

Anonymous said...

8:54. Equity instead of equality.

waitingforsupport said...

@8:54. Why do you think?

Anonymous said...

1218, I believe that the system is made up of mostly minorities, and they weren't progressing as needed. The DOE said suspensions were unfair, so they got rid of them, mostly. They DOE wanted to find a way to get grad rate higher, so they eliminated standards.

If students were doing what they needed to do, no reason to abandon standards.

Anonymous said...

3:08 I sure hope waitingforsupport wasn't expecting a serious answer to the question. Anyone who would solely blame students for not "doing what they needed to do" for the DOE "abandoning standards" has very limited thinking and in denial about the breakdown in systems. That answer is just stupid ASF. You must be trolling and baiting because I can't imagine anyone in education can be this stupid.

Anonymous said...

3:08 what does the system being made up of mostly minorities have to do with anything? Maybe it's the racist teachers who don't care about the students unless their parents march. Not that they would really care if their parents march, that's just the excuse of the day.

You say "the DOE said suspensions were unfair so they got rid of them". Those are the abandoned standards you were referring to? I hope you're not a teacher because you're EXHBIT A why schools are in trouble. What a dumb azz.

Anonymous said...

Suspensions and grading (grad rate) were mentioned. Clearly they eliminated standards to show more achievement, whether the achievement was valid or not. Most people on here agree that there is grade fraud.

You don't blame the students, the ones who are supposed to care, for not caring? The stats tell the clear story.

Anonymous said...

The chancellor — who has has been much more forceful in calling out racial disparities in student punishments than his predecessor — has said there will be “no sacred cows” as he rethinks the manual.

After two rounds of changes to school discipline policies since Mayor Bill de Blasio took office in 2014, suspensions have fallen by 32 percent, though big disparities have persisted.

The chancellor has signaled that reducing suspensions and racial disparities will be at the center of the education department’s revisions.

Almost 90% of out-of-school suspensions were issued to black or Hispanic students last school year, a group that comprises 67% of the city’s students.

Disparities in who gets suspended have remained stubborn despite two waves of discipline reforms under de Blasio. Black students receive about 46% of the city’s suspensions, despite being 26% of the student body, according to the most recent suspension data.

Anonymous said...

2022-Roughly 91% of Asian students graduated within four years, compared with 82% of white students, 79% percent of Black students and 78% of Latino students.

Janeuary 2020-Last year, 88.2 percent of Asian-American students in the city, 85 percent of Whites, 73.7 percent of Black students and 72 percent of Hispanic students graduated on time.

Anonymous said...

Great question. Why have standards been abandoned?

Anonymous said...

322,

Do tell. What's the reason?

Anonymous said...

White and Asian students were disproportionately offered admission to G&T programs (representing 35% of the kindergarten population but 81% of G&T offers for that grade in 2017-18) compared to Black and Latino students (representing 65% of the population but 18% of offers).

What can we do? Eliminate the standard.

The Department of Education announced in February 2021 that the city would temporarily eliminate the use of a single test into gifted programs and instead revert to lottery and teacher referrals – a process that the lawsuit contends does not address the existing segregation and is not "pedagogically sound."

Is that not abandoning standards to find equity?

Anonymous said...

8:54: Easy answer the kids can't reach them. If you have no standards, you can't say the kids are meeting standards. How do you reduce suspensions in your school? Don't give out any suspensions and let the kids do what they want.

Anonymous said...

8:33 it's not about "not blaming the students". You can't solely blame the students. We've heard time and again that there are no structures in place in many schools. That there is a lot of dysfunction in the DOE. That students can come and go as they please and still pass. That teachers just throw papers at their students. That teachers don't care because supposedly don't care. So the parents don't care (allegedly), and the teachers don't care, and it's the students fault?? That's just utterly ridiculous and limited in thinking.

Anonymous said...

10:13 our school has not eliminated or even reduced suspensions. Our administration has to answer for it, and they get called on the carpet by the higher-ups, but that has not stopped the suspensions. The students are not out of control at our school. Our biggest problem is girls fighting over boyfriends but the classrooms are not in a state of chaos with students not learning, and we had a very high pass rate on the ELA exam, including by the freshmen who were included. At the beginning of year, we're reminded that classroom management is first and foremost because without it there is no learning. Anytime I've mentioned this on this blog, people come from different directions making excuses as to why it can't be done, why they don't care, and mocking the methods that we use. The difference is, we also care about the students.

Anonymous said...

It's the fault of 13 and 14 year olds that there are no standards in place. Lol.

Anonymous said...

9:37 all very nice but I don't think they were referring to G&T or other specific standards. I was thinking more day to day standards in regular schools. But maybe not.

waitingforsupport said...

@836 pm. And don't leave out the fact that they receive 95% of a system designed to NOT educate them. With the willing help of so many. This allows a false narrative that they are not capable. Anyone with a piece of a brain and willingness to open a book will see this narrative of asians and whites being more able isn't true. As for standards i would just want to know who SET the standards. Standards are set by someone. Equity is a leveling the playing field. Imo

James Eterno said...

Name the school, please? You are complimenting the administration so why would you be afraid to tell us? You would not be giving yourself away either.

Anonymous said...

Whos set the the standards?

As stated above, Carranza, Porter and Banks are the last 3 in charge, none were white or Asian. They specifically stated that certain groups lagged, called it unfair...Like magic, grad rates went up and suspensions went WAY down. Now, I hear daily, that attendance doesn;t count.

Do you remember being in high school and being told that if you hit 5 absences you automatically failed the marking period? I do

Anonymous said...

One of the problems with suspensions is that students with disabilities are not supposed to be suspended for issues that are a part of their disability, and that can be challenged by the parent. All students who are suspended are supposed to be provided with work that they can complete. Some do, some don't but teachers are supposed to provide that. If it's an in-house suspension they are more likely to complete it.

So, if suspensions go down, and students are not missing as much school, or classwork, I can see why graduation rates would go up. That's not to say that all who graduate are deserving of it, it's clear they're not.

Anonymous said...

Their behavior is their fault. Refusal to do work is their fault. What is the age borderline? My transfer school has 22 year old students. Can they be blamed? Coming to school high? Not coming to school at all and then cursing a teacher while demanding a 65?

Anonymous said...

I think a big part of the breakdown in standards and students not engaging as they should is social media and the peer pressure that comes with it. Imagine being bullied online. Or being allowed to have your phone during classes. When there's a fight it's the talk of the school and everyone has to share the video. During summer school a youtuber asked a couple of students if they could be recorded. The person warned them it could go viral and the guys didn't care and agreed. It was such a dumb video and they weren't doing anything wrong, but they were wearing masks and hoodies on a hot summer day. Viral it went and there were a lot of comments from strangers about the generation, how they were dumb, talk about the parents. These guys could not stop talking about it, and looking at the video over and over and feeling bad about themselves. It finally calmed down and a few weeks later, someone came in and said "you've gone viral". I explained that it was old news but it had started spreading on another platform. Lol.

Anonymous said...

11:19 right here on this blog people wrote that students hang out in the park, come and go as they please, come in high, do no work, and still pass the class. It may be the students fault to hang out in the park, but it is the TEACHERS fault that they pass them and the students are being conditioned for failure in life, and in learning. It's the DOE's system's fault for removing standards. And yeah it's your fault if you don't send the high 22 year old home.

What do you mean "cursing at a teacher demanding a 65". You're in a transfer school and there are no protocols in place for removing an absentee student who is cursing you out for a grade? You can't say you consider them a threat? What do you do, change the grade?

You folks need a backbone before school starts in September because nobody's going to save you unless you stick up for yourselves. I remember posting about a teacher who kicked a desk when a 6'5, 300+ student became threatening. The response by one pansy on this blog was a whiney "is that supposed to be classroom management"? Yeah, for that teacher it was, and it only had to happen once and that student learned that no one was afraid of him. Find what works for you. Some will still get high, still be absent, but at least you won't be bullied and cursed out in your own classroom.


Anonymous said...

Students need to be told not to smoke during school? Not to walk in/out if the building during class time? Not to come in high? Don’t think a decent human would know better? Perhaps not raised properly.

waitingforsupport said...

I guess it's easier to point out other folks issues. For example I know entire school educators (adults) who toss away their ethics by issuing fake grades. I think to myself if these educators need to be told that this is wrong. I would think a decent human would know better. Perhaps the students were raised by the same type of parents as the educators.

Anonymous said...

Know why there is no protocol? My colleagues pass those no shows. I take the backlash.

waitingforsupport said...

@4:29am. And some of the commenters mention that they are "paid to teach and not be a counselor" . The gag is that they aren't even teaching. Others will point to the parents, mayor, libs, spongebob, etc and say "it's them. They are the problem" . It's so easy to just throw up your hands and say "i give in" Come on now people. Stop being foolish. You ain't doing the right thing. Period. @4:29 am is not a super hero. They are simply carrying out their duties. It is a good thing! Don't hate

waitingforsupport said...

@10:12 am. It's interesting that you are only focusing on the last 3. You keep on focusing on them. It seems as if it is a comfort to you.

waitingforsupport said...

@1:35pm. There will ALWAYS be that one person who is terrified. If i have to give up my ethics and morals in order to do a job--im leaving that job. Now if your ethics are already tilting towards being shaky--it will be easier to slip right on down that rabbit hole. Remember don't throw stones if your house is made of glass.

Anonymous said...

Ok, Farina, Walcott..Who cares? None were white or Asian. Want to invoke the name of Cathy Black? When did the standards get thrown out? And why?

Anonymous said...

2:44 you're talking about teenagers you fool. They need boundaries, and structure, and direction. Please, for the love of God, get out of teaching.

Anonymous said...

waitingforsupport @3:30, imagine that. Educators needing to be told that they shouldn't commit grade fraud. The nerve to pass judgment on others. Such hypocrites.

Anonymous said...

waitingforsupport @3:41, you know why. Yet we are supposed to be the first line of defense, or whatever. It's the students and Banks' fault that they passed a student who never came to class and never did the work. They're full of excuses.

Anonymous said...

waitingforsupport, hahahah @"spongebob" That came out of nowhere. I can't imagine the type of misery they're facing in September. There is zero joy in anything they say regarding their students or teaching.

Even though I wish I had more time off I'm not mortified at the thought of returning. I can't wait to see how tall they've gotten, and I know they'll be stopping by to say their hellos and get their hugs, tell me about their summers, the relationships that went kaput. The freshmen, as I always say, now that's another story. At least for the first semester. Lol.

Anonymous said...

The problem is that they cite the DOE grading policy saying that attendance doesn't count and their students met the standards.

Anonymous said...

Some of these comments are rather disgusting. The parents are blamed for not bringing up their children properly and likely because they had no proper upbringing of their own. So what's the answer when the kids come in your classroom totally disoriented, unprepared, and low values, just give them a kick in the ass, show contempt for them, and blame them. The demographics of NYC public schools are clearly not the same as top notch private school where teachers only have to worry about teaching the curriculum. If you can't deal with the issues facing inner city students, you should find another profession. Or shut the fuck up about it. Some have literally blamed everyone but the actual people in the classroom. They've blamed the parents, chancellors, mayors, admin, students, blm, everybody's fault but the people who are actually charged with teaching the students.

Anonymous said...

So excuse the behavior and lack of effort?

Anonymous said...

1007 PM

Confused. Are they bad students because they have all those problems and bad parents or are they good students?

Anonymous said...

Everyone, everyone should start taking responsibility. One thing that can be done is lower class size, really meaning to regulate it better, stop the overcrowding.

Fixing all of society? Maybe next year. Meaning next school year, of course.

Anonymous said...

It's like going around in circles with you guys and one has to wonder if people are really this dense or if these are just gaslighting comments. Who said anything about "excuse the behavior, and lack of effort".

Anonymous said...

10:07 The word "bad" is subjective, so what do you think, oh dim one? A lot of your comments start with "confused" and always looking for someone to keep explaining, so don't worry about it. Maybe for your next stunt you can try and find solutions for for your specific situation and classroom. No one else is going to save you.

Anonymous said...

Is it really the teacher’s fault when a student misbehaves in class? During 7th grade, back in my student days in junior high, my English teacher periodically took the class to the school library for a “library lesson” by the school librarian. She then promptly left the library for the remainder of the period. One day, two girls started fighting in the library, and one bit the other on the arm. The bloodcurdling shriek was loud and long, followed by general pandemonium. Fast forward about ten years. The biter was now a tenured Early Childhood teacher for the DOE. She lost it in the classroom one day, corporally punished a student, and shouted, “I hate children!” To make a long story short, she was brought up on 3020-a charges and was fired. What’s she doing currently? She decided that it was time for a career change, went to law school, and passed the bar exam. Nowadays, she’s a criminal defense attorney. Truth is stranger than fiction!

JR said...

My school has 50% attendance daily, on average. Smaller classes mean nothing. A legit grading and attendance policy would make the studnets choose if they want to graduate or not.

They currrently know they can attend once a week, do all the work the last 3 days of each marking period and pass almost every class.

Magically, the last 3 days of each marking peirod, attendance gores way up. All if a sudden their jobs, their family issues, their problems at home don't exist.

Shame on both my colleagues and the students. Oh, and shame on banks for having a policy that says you can have 0% attendance and pass.

“One such school is the Eagle Academy for Young Men of Harlem, where in 8th grade, 95% of students failed Math proficiency according to New York State standardized testing, but the school passed 93.9% of them in that subject. The founder and former head of the Eagle Academy network, David Banks, is now Chancellor of the New York City Department of Education. He quickly banished standardized tests from large swathes of NYC’s education landscape.”

So, everyone failed the assessment, yet everyone passed the class. Nobody can pass, yet everyone passes. I wonder why we have record graduation rate every year.

Banks says attendance, preparedness, participation and behavior do not count. Obviously, assessments in his own school do not count either.

"Grading must be based primarily on content area knowledge and skills and not on non-mastery measures. Schools may not factor attendance into students’ grades or grade students predominantly on participation or preparedness."

Anonymous said...

@10:39 Confused. Are they bad teachers because they can't find a workaround to inspire or handle the students in their classroom, or are they good teachers even though there is ongoing failure in their classroom?

Anonymous said...

@ 10:07 Who said they had bad parents? You can't teach what you don't know. Sorta like some of you.

Anonymous said...

10:07 PM said,

"The parents are blamed for not bringing up their children properly and likely because they had no proper upbringing of their own. So what's the answer when the kids come in your classroom totally disoriented, unprepared, and low values"

Seems like bad parenting and low values. Not good. Can we lay blame on them yet?

Anonymous said...

You first 12:56 "Are they bad teachers because they can't find a workaround to inspire or handle the students in their classroom, or are they good teachers even though there is ongoing failure in their classroom?"

You get paid to teach. You're supposed to know better. Was taught strategies in classroom management, and CRE. Obviously you didn't learn a thing. When are you going to start blaming yourself.

Anonymous said...

9:26 sooooo was that the teacher's fault or not? I'm not sure what the moral of your story is.

Anonymous said...

You forgot this part "just give them a kick in the ass, show contempt for them, and blame them." Do you really think that's the answer?

Anonymous said...

This is actually for 10:39 "Who said they had bad parents? You can't teach what you don't know. Sorta like some of you."

Anonymous said...

JR @9:46 - why do you have such a problem with this ""Grading must be based primarily on content area knowledge and skills and not on non-mastery measures. Schools may not factor attendance into students’ grades or grade students predominantly on participation or preparedness."

I'm really curious on your perspective on this (and waitingforsupport if she's around). I don't care for the perspective of the idiot who can't teach @12:56 but loves dictating to others what teaching should look like.

Anonymous said...

12:56 we'll just blame you for being a bad teacher.

Anonymous said...

JR

JR said...

So students can pass with 0% attendance? How are students mastering the work on if they have no interaction with a teacher? I’d love to see the standards a student who is never present can meet? Especially low level students. Aren’t we inviting students to NOT attend? Isn’t rule number 1 in life to present? Are we making them career and college ready?

People on this blog go on and on about teaching. Ok, to teach the student must be present, right? Participate? Be engaged? Bell to bell instruction? The DOE says there is no remote instruction. How do students pass with no attendance, preparedness or participation?

Oh. The teacher has no standard so everyone passes.

Anonymous said...

There’s a lot of middle ground between “The students and parents suck. Screw them Im not even going to try to teach.” AND “If you’re class is unmanageable you suck as a teacher and it’s probably because you’re a racist.” If you’ve never worked in an abusive school and never witnessed colleagues tormented by students and administrators, you should transfer to one and give us a follow up opinion on judging other teachers. It’s not a pretty sight. Lost sleep over colleagues. And yes I tried to help as did others.

Anonymous said...

12:56 by the way you post it doesn't seem as if you received a proper upbringing either and you also have very low values, much lower than the students who come in without a notebook or pencil, or maybe smoked a little weed before class. You have very low values for a person working in education. Does that make your parents bad parents?

waitingforsupport said...

@129

Anonymous said...

"95% of students failed Math proficiency according to New York State standardized testing, but the school passed 93.9% of them in that subject"

I thought most teachers and parents wanted NY to do away with standardized testing because they're not worth anything? I don't know about the particular situation in your school, but I know that many teachers are not teaching to the test. I've spoken with high school students that as of May had not seen an actual Regents exam in any subject area. If a student has good attendance, does their work, and is doing well based on the work they are given in class, they should pass the class regardless of the test.

Anonymous said...

LOL. That says a lot about the teacher if the students can never attend yet pass. We've sunk to a new low. I agree with JR, that should be unacceptable.

Anonymous said...

654,

The issue is that Banks says that attendance and participation and behavior and preparaedness don't count.

Ok.

Then they have to meet the stanadrd.

They took the test, they almost all, 95%, failed. Yet, they all passed the class.

Nothing counts, clearly..Oh, they all graduated...

Anonymous said...

3:50 I don't think I've ever seen anyone say "if your class is unmanageable you suck as a teacher" unless it is in response to a particular troll who likes to bait and claim they throw papers at the students without paying them any attention, or one who does not find any middle ground when it comes to blaming the parents and everyone else but themselves.

The issue is not an unmanageable class at the beginning of the school year, but trying to get a handle on it as the months go on. We were actually having a discussion some months back when we were discussing several scenarios but here comes the "can't do" folks pouring water on any suggestions that were made. So yes, those teachers' classes are unmanageable because they suck as a teacher.

There's an african proverb: Smooth seas do not make skillful sailors. I've spent some time this summer reflecting on what I might try differently to tighten up my practices because I know those freshmen are going to come rolling in, sizing us up and in a week or so they're unmanageable. I have to figure out what tricks I'll have up my sleeve.
I know one teacher who at the end of every class she takes extra copies of the day's work, put the student's name on it, and places it in the folder. Very easy for students who were absent to check for missing work, and you don't have to go digging for it later.

And finally, I have worked in abusive schools and seen colleagues tormented by students and admin. It's sad and disgusting. Nobody is ok with that. But in those same schools with abusive admin and students they do not target everyone only those who they think they can get away with it, and that's not to say they think they can't get away with it, with me. They try it, they try all of us. The best defense is to have structures in place and don't pass them if they haven't done the work. For all of their goofiness they do like passing their classes.

Anonymous said...

7:04 but you can't just make a blanket statement and assume that those students who failed the State test weren't attending school. It's a good talking point about Banks but there isn't enough information in that post for you to make that leap.

Anonymous said...

"The issue is that Banks says that attendance and participation and behavior and preparaedness don't count."

Banks is not in our classrooms or auditing our grades. If you decide to pass students who don't attend, and don't do work, and can't show that they've passed the standards that you've set in your class, that's on you. I'm not talking about standardized tests. That's just moving the goal posts. Most schools will not fail a student just because they didn't pass a standardized test (some schools will have it count as a final and it will get factored into their grade) but they will not fail the class based on the test alone).

It's not just about students who don't attend and don't do any work. That should be an automatic fail and yet all of the discussion centers around them.

waitingforsupport said...

Well put @7:13 pm

waitingforsupport said...

@129. Im confused as to why and even if some folks
find it so hard to understand who passes/fails. Educators are supposed to be able to understand and stand on the grading policy. Periodt. What are the mastery measures? How do you assess your students? If a student never shows up(zero attendance)--they are a no show. No shows don't pass my class.

waitingforsupport said...

Correct @814pm

waitingforsupport said...

@8:09 am. I have a strong feeling that your students know that you are doing your job the way it's supposed to be done. They respect that even if some may push back. I wish you a successful school year. Those who blame the students, parents, Banks, etc will NEVER blame themselves for issuing fake grades. I guess it's how they were raised.

waitingforsupport said...

@10:07 pm is correct. Let me say:
1. if a student behaves in one class it tells me that they know how to behave but choose not to behave in the other classes.
2. If a teacher behaves like a computer and just passes everyone, they have "lower values" than the students/parents who they are judging. Teachers are "educated" and know better.
3. When the commenters bring up poverty, welfare, parents who "don't care" they leave out the fact that they helped create it by "passing everyone" . They are the system workers who hate the product they are helping to create. The definition of insanity is...you know the rest.

waitingforsupport said...

@1031 pm. I can ask you the same question regarding those folks who pass everyone: "So excuse the behavior and lack of effort"? When were ready to hold EVERYONE accountable for their Behavior we can have an honest discussion if James open the floor. Until then all of this bulls^it about the student parent behavior is juvenile.

Anonymous said...

Some teachers on this blog would rather take the advice of those who say it's just a job, don't care about it, and pass everyone just like Admin says to keep the peace. Except they have no peace and then come here to complain about the chaos in their classroom and the disrepect they're shown.

Anonymous said...

I agree waitingforsupport. It's like they're arguing with themselves. We say fail the kids who don't come and don't show effort and their response is "so excuse the behavior and lack of effort"? Lol.

Anonymous said...

Also waitingforsupport, you are so right. I remember being that class, where students worked in other classes but not mine It was an end of day class and I was so beat. I know I didn't put in the effort. It was bad but we had good days and bad days in terms of the work we got done. Still they didn't act out of control because that's rule #1. We just didn't put in our best effort. I certainly didn't blame them. Besides, what am I saying about myself if I say that we accomplished nothing despite my best effort. I would hate to think I can't get it together if I really tried, or at least have them show some improvement.

Anonymous said...

“If you decide to pass students who don't attend, and don't do work, and can't show that they've passed the standards that you've set in your class, that's on you.”

Many of my colleagues do this, and it makes it impossible for me to have a standard.

waitingforsupport said...

@1028 pm. And then those commenters want to be respected by students. Those commenters are bragging about just following the system in place. They know it screws up student lives but they complain that "the students show no respect. Who in their right mind is going to respect someone who doesn't show you respect? Students begin to think ALL teachers don't really care. The job becomes even more challenging for teachers who are actually teaching. When i read some of these comments about student and parents not having any values i just laugh. Those same commenters don't have values either.

Anonymous said...

I find it hard to compare a teacher with a bachelors and masters who is just so frustrated with a completely broken system Vs a student who comes to school to cause trouble, many have criminal records, no pen, no paper, cell phone all day…

Anonymous said...

What are you saying 3:28? The student who is a casualty of a completely broken system should have better coping skills, and presence of mind to do what's right versus an educated and supposedly highly trained adult? What?? As far as cellphones, speak to your CL and see if there's a way to take cell phones at the door. It's a start to making things so much better.

Maybe I should stop posting for the rest of the summer. Y'all make it sound like it's an impossible situation and I'd hate for it to rub off on me.

Anonymous said...

waitingforsupport 12:55 you are absolutely correct.

Anonymous said...

As far as no shows passing-This was sent by my AP.

“The kids who do the work and get passing grades should not fail the course regardless of attendance.”

So no shows or hardly shows can pass.

Anonymous said...

Don’t read, at least not seriously.

Heard of doomscrolling? This is doomposting.

Anonymous said...

You're right 3:28, there is no comparison.

Anonymous said...

5:48 how are no shows going to do the work and get passing grades? Lol.

Anonymous said...

Simple, teachers post the work in Google classroom.

Or they could attend once a week or one per month.

Anonymous said...

Lol. My school has an attendance team to figure out why our attendance is so bad. I told them it’s because we pass people who never attend. I told them that students say that teachers let them do Online work and/or they can just show up the last few days of each marking period and do all 6 weeks of work. Supervisors refuse to question teachers about how they can justify students passing with 10% attendance.

Anonymous said...

9:55 I figured you'd say that. I set it up last year because we were asked, but I dont post work on Google Classroom and it's not mandated anywhere that we must do that while also teaching live. But if one is going to post the work, including quizzes, exams, group projects (don't know how they'd do that) then why would they have a problem with students completing it for a grade? Have you ever seen a no show student complete all their work online? Seems like just more complaining to me. If you're going to post the work dont complain if students do it. Is that the complaint now? No wonder they're confused.

Anonymous said...

10:11 it's the student's fault that they're told they can do the work online, or that they can come in the last few days to complete 6 weeks worth of work?
First of all, its highly suspect that anyone can complete six weeks worth of work in 6 days. One project alone can be six days. One exam is two days. C'mon. High School level work or kindergarten? You people are funny. 6:54 is right about doomposting. Hahahah

Anonymous said...

Omg, that’s my point. It’s the fault of teachers for having no standards. You want the school. I’ll gladly post it. But it’s happening almost everywhere. And yes, students who never attend pass the classes by doing online work or attending the last few days if a no.

Yes, students are lousy students if they never attend and we can’t change that but they certainly shouldn’t pass.

My begging admin to follow up on this has fallen on deaf ears. And I get verbally abused by students and some staff members because I have standards.

Anonymous said...

1029 is right. I have students in my school with 25% attendance with a 90 average.

Anonymous said...

I don't think they're lousy students if they're told they can do the work online and they do it. They don't set the standards, you do.

I'm curious 10:29, do you call parents and let them know that their little darling is verbally abusive? It's true that, try as they might, some parents have no control over the students, but some do. I wouldn't stand for it.

You can only worry about the grades you give and let other teachers worry about theirs. If they want to put all the work online and pass the students who complete it, that's on them. Some colleges offer asynchronous or synchronous classes, so it is what it is in this technology age. But nobody's obligated to put work online. I post work online on a case by case basis. Not all students who don't attend are lousy students. They have to navigate through a very challenging commute, and some are bullied in school. Had one student who refused to come in, and I did post work for him and passed him. Eventually he was placed on home instruction based on a legit medical diagnosis. I doubt many even knew or cared what happened with him and just labeled him a lousy student with a parent who didn't care, even though I remember her struggles to get him properly situated.

waitingforsupport said...

@3:22pm. I just wanted 8:54pm to throw up the bile that I believed was living in their body. And as I expected--they certainly did. It's further proof about how the threatened/intimidated people think. They always meet my expectations.

Anonymous said...

lol. Parents? What’s that? There is zero parental involvement with 19-22 year old students.

Anonymous said...

I agree, it’s highly suspect that students can pass honestly who never attend, who can’t read or write English and who can’t do basic math. They all pass. Who shall I tell?

waitingforsupport said...

@328...please break down what you mean. Also it's amazing how some commenters never speak of the students who are actually in school on a daily basis. The students who believe they are being challenged academically; who believe the honor roll is really an achievement; the students who are possibly the first in their family to graduate hs and go to college. I never read posts about how these educators successfully provide those students with a challenging more rigorous curriculum. Share how many of those students do not have to take remedial math and english classes in college. How many students return to say they did not drop out of college because your class prepared them to meet the challenge? All some of these so called educators talk about are "criminals" . I guess that speaks to how they view the people in their class. But hey, you're better than the students and their parents. You sleep well. You're children go to school where standards are upheld because gosh darn, the people in your community are good people. Got it

waitingforsupport said...

@548pm. We are NOT talking about students who do the work.

waitingforsupport said...

@12:09am. These comments can't be real. If they are real it just proves how behind we are as a country. Smh

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