This is from Yahoo via Bloomberg:
(Bloomberg) -- New York City schools are looking to expand in-class attendance by changing a rule that closed buildings for at least 10 days where two Covid-19 infections were reported, and by permitting students to sit closer together.
Mayor Bill de Blasio said the new considerations may encourage more parents to choose in-class learning over remote instruction, so he extended an opt-in period to Friday from Wednesday.
“We’ve looked at the data, we’ve looked at the facts and decided it’s time for a change,” de Blasio said Monday at a press briefing.
de Blasio said new policies will lead to more classrooms and schools being open and a more stable schedule. The majority of New York City students are learning from home.
The mayor's timing makes no sense. He is willing to put students at risk as the B117 variant is spreading and impacting children more than original COVID-19. Remember, kids under 16 cannot get vaccinated.
This is from ABC 7 Chicago:
CHILDREN NOW PLAYING 'HUGE ROLE' IN SPREAD OF COVID-19 VARIANT, EXPERT SAYS
New developments in the COVID-19 pandemic has one leading epidemiologist re-evaluating his own advice.
Dr. Michael Osterholm is the Director of the Center for Infectious Disease Research and Policy at the University of Minnesota. He was also a member of Joe Biden's COVID-19 Advisory Board during the time between Biden being elected president and inaugurated.
Osterholm previously supported sending children back to school. He said the virus was not a major threat to children. Now, the situation has changed.
"Please understand, this B.1.1.7 variant is a brand new ball game," Osterholm said on NBC's Meet the Press. "It infects kids very readily. Unlike previous strains of the virus, we didn't see children under 8th grade get infected often or they were not frequently very ill, they didn't transmit to the rest of the community."
The B.1.1.7 variant was first identified in the United Kingdom. It's now ripping through parts of the country.
In Minnesota, Osterholm said more than 740 schools reported cases of the variant. In Michigan more young people are ended up in hospitals fighting more serious symptoms than previously seen in children with COVID-19.
This is similar to what health officials have seen in other countries.
The British Medical Journal wrote two months ago that "emerging evidence from Israel and Italy (shows) more young children are being infected with new variants of COVID-19."
Seeing that happen in his own backyard, Osterholm is now questioning his own previous advice.
"Anywhere you look where you see this emerging, you see that kids are playing a huge role in the transmission of this," Osterholm said. "All the things that we had planned for about kids in schools with this virus are really no longer applicable. We've got to take a whole new look at this issue."
Vaccinations are expected to help fight off the B.1.1.7 variant. However, Osterholm said there's simply not enough time to just rely on vaccinations.
"We're not going to have nearly enough (vaccine doses) in the next 6 to 8 weeks to get through this surge, and we're going to have to look at other avenues to do that just as every other country in the world who's had a B.1.1.7 surge has had to do."
Leave COVID policy on variants to Bill de Blasio and Andrew Cuomo. What could go wrong?
UFT President Michael Mulgrew is saying that updating COVID rules in schools is a state issue so de Blasio can't change NYC school COVID policy without state approval. Let's see where this goes.
The full Mulgrew statement:
Here are the latest NY COVID numbers from the NY Times:
92 comments:
Mulgrews response..
https://twitter.com/ZachReports/status/1379118249103785989?s=20
James, or anyone else, does any of this surprise you? This is playing out exactly as I thought it would and I don’t think I’m smarter than everyone else so what gives? Couldn’t we have written these headlines months ago? NY politicians, Randi and Mike all want schools fully open. What made anyone ever think otherwise? We’re opening. We’re decreasing protocols. We will continue to open more fully and decrease protocols until none are left or none are enforced. Upcoming headline: DeBlasio declares nyc schools fully open. Social distancing no longer necessary as long as everyone wears a mask.
This is what I pay all my dues for? see this James fro what the UFT does, and not what it says.
QUESTION: What does this mean immediately? In other words, If a student in a particular classroom has a positive covid test does that mean that ONLY that kid has to quarantine or does the whole class have to quarantine as well? If the teacher is vaccinated do they have to quarantine? This question needs to be answered by the DOE NOW because we are still testing in schools even if the "2 case full closure" is not happening anymore. This news broke a few hours ago and no immediate response from the UFT. Typical. I guess our gold standard just turned to tin.
City officials are just making up Covid rules as they see fit. If they seem so confident with these new. protocols—why aren’t the Eva Markowitz Charters back to on site learning—why is 65 Court St, 52 Broadway TRS, and the Klein DOE Chambers St. Palace—still not open to the public?
I thought that King Mulgrew said that DeBlasio can't open with the 3 foot rule until Cuomo allows it? As usual, crickets from the UFT.
The mayor's latest permutations mean little, logistically, in the real lives of students, families, communities, the constituency the mayor is appealing to as he works hard to forge and harden his legacy as a progressive democrat and prepares for the changing of the guard, and symbolically it means even less, but this is Bill De Blasio, a man that who has spent his life in politics, and to his credit, got himself elected of the greatest city in the world, but a man who can't figure out how tp do anything as a mayor, as the man in charge of our city, and that includes, unfortunately, the largest schools system in America.
For us, the teachers, it is much ado about less than nothing.
1:33 PM, isn't that the way things are supposed to be happening at this point?
Lockdowns are expensive. It's much cheaper for NYC to have 2,100 COVID deaths a month, 10,000 hospitalizations a month, 40,000 people contracting long COVID a month, and 120,000 people contracting the disease period each month. Much much cheaper!
We have to start opening up again. It’s time.
We can’t go on like this forever.
Who gives a shit if tens of thousands of kids get long term covid and some die? We can't wait. What a selfish country.
In my previous life I did work in the grim business of death and money. I know more about the trade off than almost anyone. Yes, @4:33, you hit it on the hard head with a great hammer: it's about money, death, and words or shit (take your pick).
Money always wins.
I always take that trade no matter how guilty it makes me feel.
And so should you.
Keep Kool But Kare,
S
Each of you, $1500 well spent. LOL.
Teachers' union opposes NYC move to change COVID-19 school closure rules https://trib.al/pUK9T6K
4:41: Thank you Ms. Porter. If the schools are so safe, my question is why are they allowing so many students in staff to learn from home. It just seems a waste to open to only 20 percent of students and who knows how many of those show up each day? Also, the kids are just doing remote learning in the schools anyway. I don't know how people can consider the way kids are learning in the schools as a sense of normalcy.
I choose our lives. Jacinda Ardern chose life so they had real travel bans and hard lockdowns in a democratic country. Now they live pretty normally in New Zealand.. You can have both.
I agree with you James
I agree with you James.
First US case of 'double mutant' Indian variant is found in California
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-9437277/First-case-infectious-double-mutant-Indian-covid-variant-identified-California.html?ito=social-twitter_dailymailus
Facts:
Under 300 minors in the US have died in the US with the coronavirus.
About 1000 minors in the US die of drowning every year.
I think it’s time. Can’t keep shutting down the schools. Long Island is NOT closing. Quarantine the sick person only. No need to quarantine close contacts as well. Get rid of the ten day closure rule. Time to get back to normal. People are vaccinated.
Teach NY , you been signing that song since day one. STFU already.
We're still clocking around 60 deaths and 4000 cases every day right now. There's no downwards trend any more, it's just stable. I could never have predicted, even a couple of months ago, that things would be this bad for this long and we would not only do nothing, but reopen!
If students do come back, then accommodations should be rescinded. Especially those teachers who are posting their social gatherings and outings on social media.
Yeah TeachNY. No dissenting opinions allowed. The keep schools closed crowd are the only voices allowed to repeat themselves.
I choose our lives too, but my point is that we don't get to choose, we don't live in NZ.
Money chooses here in the US, technology chooses here in the US.
And I put my money on Money and Tech because I know they are going to win here.
And doing so has given me an early retirement so I don't need to beg at Albany's door for and ERI.
And I take some but not much solace in the fact that the Democrats, though I am not a member of their party, are spending the money now but I have no delusions about what their priorities are, and they are not lives, ours or the nations, but Money Technology.
I know too that Unity will win in the election and that's why I'm putting my money on me not the UFT.
In Europe, where the Virus is raging the Markets are at all time highs. Here too. Asset prices are bubbling up and can't fight the tape, and the Fed, or the cutthroat capitalism that America practices.
The idea that democratic or social democratic parties or unions will temper the excesses of cutthroat capital, when it works in places like NZ, of the Nordics, is only further counterbalanced by more cutthroat measures elsewhere, this is the much maligned Neo-Liberalism that comes from the Heartland of America, the University of Chicago School of Economics, and it is the American way, and it will not be seriously tempered by MS Yellen and her plans for a more coordinated global tax structure or by any other measure that springs from America. In America, as the Chinese say, "It's about the Money."
https://scholar.harvard.edu/files/jrobinson/files/varieties_of_capitalism_april_9_2013.pdf
My prediction: There is going to be a massive rift in September between NYC teachers who are vaccinated and those who are not. Mulgrew's email stated that vaccinated teachers will not need to quarantine if exposed to a Covid positive person. (I am guessing that includes being exposed to a Covid positive student at school) Thus, any teacher who is unvaccinated will still have to quarantine and that means that vaccinated teachers in the building are going to be covering those classes.
It’s time to open up society. If you feel uncomfortable, then you have the right to never leave your house again. I feel comfortable. I travel, go to gyms and restaurants. Soon, when movies come out I want to see, I will go to a theater.
We need to stop the back and forth and the ‘we aren’t ready’ attitude.
Yeah, either we all go back or not. The accommodations, many of which are fake, need to be gone.
"Anywhere you look where you see this emerging, you see that kids are playing a huge role in the transmission of this," Osterholm said. "All the things that we had planned for about kids in schools with this virus are really no longer applicable.”
By September, teachers will have had 10 months to get the vaccine, ample opportunity. Students and teachers need to all be back in September. If they want to make it optional, fine, I'll work remotely too.
We go back to buildings when it is safe, not a minute before. Anyone on accommodation posting from vacation or beach house on social media needs to take it down right away. SCI might look into it. Kids are not safe now in school buildings. Look at Michigan.
You realize that all this writing we're doing means nothing? Nobody cares. Remember the strike threat in September? Remember filling MSG in 2005. We will continue to be laughed at, stepped on and abused. Remember the angry mulgrew youtube videos. He was pissed, right. How sad for us. Nice work everybody.
More than 38,000 vehicle fatality every year in US. An additional 4.4 million are injured seriously enough to require medical attention. Yet, we don't ban cars even owning a car is not a Necessity.
The answer is not to ban cars, but get traffic under management. The same is true for COVID. We should not shut everything down but be wise about what we do.
Excess deaths per 100,000 in US from COVID 132. Increase in deaths 12.9%, One of the highest of any country. 38,000 traffic fatalities vs 555,000 COVID deaths in a little over a year. Are some people here really that stupid? It's a fucking pandemic.
https://www.cebm.net/covid-19/excess-mortality-across-countries-in-2020/
Yes some people here are really that stupid and/or misinformed that they're still locked in their basements.
For anyone of working or school age the virus is less deadly than the flu, drowning, slips and falls, etc.
We are so close to ending this with vaccinations. If we didn't have covidiots racing to open everything prematurely, we could save thousands of lives.
8:24: Yes I agree with you about the accommodations. I know teachers with accommodations who went on vacations taking airplanes to visit people and others having gatherings in their homes. If you are scared about Covid you wouldn't be doing these things.
Any word on if/when they may rescind medical accommodations?
Also any idea how many students are opting back in to in-person?
De Blasio said 25,000 opted in the first two days. He has said nothing since then while extending the deadline. That should tell you something. Taking a chance now while B117 spreads in children seems crazy to me as a parent. Why risk long term COVID-19 when vaccines are coming? If everyone came back now, how would schools reprogram?
I am hoping my daughter is vaccinated this summer and then back live in September.
The school year is a wash. Ramp up Summer school and make it available to those who need/want it. I don't see Summer School being a hit given that everyone is tired. Gear up for a September re-open for all students who want to be in-person and create a remote cohort for those who wish to study remotely (allows them flexibility and lets them get a job and help their family out). This allows extra time for everyone to get vaccinated. The goal is to be fully open in September. Rushing it now when you have a bunch of teachers on accommodations and still in the process of vaccinating everyone is foolish. We've made it this far.
Why risk it? Because the risks of keeping schools and the economy closed are greater. And, the notion that vaccines and/or herd immunity will end this pandemic are false narratives. We need to manage it and most scientists agree that we've learned enough in the last year to open schools more and more and reduce the greater risks to children and teachers of the remote and hybrid teaching and learning that, while it works OK for children in certain environments, like the children of school teachers and the children of the most affluent and educated, its and abject failure for the majority of kids in cities like NYC.
No 3 feet until all building have a working ventilation systems and barrers are put on desks.
Long Island schools have these features. 3 feet in NYC schools with poor ventilation and no barriers makes no sense. Parents need to think about their kids. So do teachers.
Teachers do not need to bring this home to their families. This is not the time to drop to 3 feet. Common sense needs to prevail and Cuomo needs to not F this up too. DeBlasio is looking to pass the buck to the gov whether schools open with less students he can just blame it on Cuomo. Cuomo hopefully will be smart enough to not but children in harms way.
We shall see.
The De Blasio callousness and recklessness is unfathomable.
De Blasio is an ultimate incompetent moron for the ages.
What about the variants? Vaccinations are working but scientific evidence shows B117 spreads easily in kids. The economy opening up now fully or in a few months after most are vaccinated won't make that much difference. Not worth the cost of lives lost.
What is two months of school going to accomplish?
Engineers are working on the automobile issue by working on self driving cars.
How about the 6 feet rule for eating? That is still required.
I agree that we need to fully reopen schools. Even if it means 3ft between kids.
I looked up CDC's current best estimate on infection mortality rate:
Age Survival rate %
0-17 99.998
18-49 99.95
50-64 99.4
65+ 91.0
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/hcp/planning-scenarios.html
updated 3/19/21
Now that those at any significant risk are getting vaccinated, there's no excuse to stay closed.
Regarding the risk to students, I don't consider 0.002% fatality risk significant.
I wonder what suicide rate due to lack of social interaction, etc. is... I don't have hard data on that but if I had to bet the lives on my kids I'd bet that it's greater than 0.002
Have you or CDC factored in variants which is a big part of this posting?
No they haven't fully factored in emerging variants but:
-Based on current data it looks like some of these variants have increased transmissibility but at this point increased risk of death/severe disease is speculative. And if risk from current variants was significantly higher than baseline it'd be obvious and MSM would be screaming from the rooftops.
-Variants are expected and will continue to pop up. Fortunately as any virus evolves it tends to become more transmissible but less deadly due to evolutionary pressures. Killing people is against a viruses best interest.
-EUA for kids + actually getting them all vaccinated is going to make many months.
Like Shelley said we need to manage risk. We can't keep kids at home JUST IN CASE a more deadly variant emerges (which is unlikely due to evolutionary pressures + as evidenced by past pandemics). Especially since protecting them with vaccines against these theoretical risks will take months.
We've never shut society down to due pandemics before. If you take our current "safety first" mentality to its logical conclusion we're going to be locked away at home forever. Risk needs to be managed, not avoided entirely.
Great essay
NYC has the means to do this. It's not simply a matter of vaccinations and variants.
Herd Immunity Won’t Save Us—but We Can Still Beat Covid-19
Innovative contact tracing and just-in-time vaccination can get the pandemic under control—and prepare us for the next one
By Larry Brilliant, W. Ian Lipkin, Lisa Danzig and Karen Pak Oppenheimer
https://www.wsj.com/articles/herd-immunity-wont-save-usbut-we-can-still-beat-covid-19-11616770584
Our Mayor is a complete Moron. Has he even noticed that NYC DOE student enrollment fell to just under 1 million students from over 1.1 Million students? He cares nothing for the well being of our students nor does he care for the well being of teachers and school staff. If he cared at all about students having stability, then he would have all students completing the year Remotely. Also, don't be a fool and believe the schools Positivity Numbers. They only count from their own testing. They do not include students and teachers that inform the school and provide documentation of a Positive COVID 19 test. We should all be telling our students to complete the year as a remote student. Most of our students are not vaccinated, they are the ones that will suffer because of Dumblasio's political agenda.
There is so much we don't know. This is in today's NY Times. I can't understand how some commenters here have all the answers.
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/06/health/covid-children-inflammatory-syndrome.html?referringSource=articleShare
Many children and teenagers who developed the mysterious inflammatory syndrome that can emerge several weeks after contracting the coronavirus never had classic Covid-19 symptoms at the time of their infection, according to the largest study so far of cases in the United States.
The study, led by researchers from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, found that in over 1,000 cases in which information about whether they got sick from their initial Covid-19 illness was available, 75 percent of the patients did not experience such symptoms. But two to five weeks later, they became sick enough to be hospitalized for the condition, called Multisystem Inflammatory Syndrome in Children (MIS-C), which can affect multiple organs, especially the heart.
Published Tuesday in JAMA Pediatrics, the study said that “most MIS-C illnesses are believed to result from asymptomatic or mild Covid-19” followed by a hyper-inflammatory response that appears to occur when the patients’ bodies have produced their maximum level of antibodies to the virus. Experts do not yet know why some young people, and a smaller number of adults, respond this way.
Thirteen states have vaccinated at least 80% of seniors (first dose):
Vermont (89%!)
S Dakota
Connecticut
Maine
Rhode Island
Mass
NH
MN
WI
Kansas
Delaware
Iowa
WA
(California and Nebraska-- almost there)
To those, NY is not one of those states. Let's open up schools and kill more seniors. Great idea.
We will never have certitude. We have to accept that there is much we don't know about the pandemic and won't know until it is decades in our rear view mirror, but we do know a lot. This is not our first rodeo. It won't be our last.
We know we didn't prepare for it. We know we are very poor at preparing for remote, though often inevitable crises and disasters. We know we forget and we defund and de-emphasize and we pay higher price for not investing in prevention and insurance measures.
So it is unsafe to re-open the arbitration hearings for our spring break pay; it is also unsafe to re-open the Success Academy Charter Schools, but it is very safe to re-open the public schools and put lives at risk.
How is this even possible?
We know well over half a million have died because of COVID in the US. That is one of the worst outcomes in the world. We can probably drastically cut down on future deaths by being vigilant a while longer but we more than likely won't because of selfishness.
I can’t believe all the jealous assholes on hear ripping into the folks with accommodations. Yes, there are some who milk the system but many have serious issues that are really being safe and cautious, in their personal lives as well. I have never heard a cop or firemen bitch and moan or be jealous of a co worker who got out on 3/4 pay retirement, even though many of those claims are bs. The reason they don’t complain is because their rank and file is made up of people that stick together, not a bunch of back stabbing , jealous, pussies, like found in the teachers rank and file. Teachers have a lot to learn when it comes to sticking together. It is the major reason why this union will never be as powerful as it could be.
I can't imagine what goes through a person's mind when they know they're going to die despite having had the opportunity to save their life but chose not to. Ignorance is very costly!
The liberal media presents this situation as unavoidable: NYC has at least 4000 people a day contracting COVID, with 60 dying every day, and likely about 1,333 developing long-term health issues as a result. Because a month lockdown is just IMPOSSIBLE! https://t.co/HkDDKABETb
To the guy who said that there are "more than 38,000 vehicle fatality every year in US." 555,000 COVID-19 deaths is like almost 13 times more. NYC had around 240 fatalities from vehicle accidents last year. We get that in 4 days of COVID.
Covidiots are nauseating.
Do the barriers really do anything?
1:36: I agree that many people do have serious conditions but these people shouldn't be engaged in reckless behaviors like joining big parties and flying on packed planes. If they are too afraid to go to work then they should be too afraid to do those things too.
No one cares what teachers think. NY politicians, UFT and Randi want schools open. They’re opening. Period. End of story.
Trust me, there are quite a few of NYC teachers who are not planning on getting the vaccine. Cuomo, DeBlasio, and even Fauci have repeatedly stated that teachers will not be required to get the vaccine. However, I'll bet the farm that the DOE is going to try to find out which teachers have and have not received the vaccine. Shit, I'm even guessing the DOE will simply ask the UFT to collect info on which teachers have received the vaccine. We know that the UFT nor the DOE can not actually collect vaccine data on individual teachers by asking doctors but watch the UFT try to do some kind of secret survey of us all. Lastly, there are still going to be quite a few families who are going to opt for fully remote learning in September. ANY REMOTE TEACHING POSITION WITHIN A DISTRICT MUST BE FILLED BY LICENSE/SENIORITY.
@8:50 I DO NOT GIVE A SHIT teachers had 10-12 months I am not getting the vaccine, my body. Thousands have died from getting the vaccine and there is no science side effects 2-3 years down road. 99.6 survival rate I am liking my chances. Maybe if I was 75-80 I would be singing a different tune.
September 20-30% high school students will choose remote. Live will be busy classrooms will feel heavier still believe tons of older students prefer being home using and abusing the system to get their "education"
This is the same bullshit CDC and mayor who changes 3% closures to basically 10% It is a joke!
Anon 2323 gets his news from sources most would consider on the fringe. I respect him as he seems to be pro-union. There were teachers like him at Jamaica who supported me as CL.
That said, I have to respond to the statement. "Thousands have died from getting the vaccine..."
While the CDC has been far from perfect during the COVID-19 pandemic, I don't see bad faith there.
This is what CDC says about vaccines and death:
"Over 167 million doses of COVID-19 vaccines were administered in the United States from December 14, 2020, through April 5, 2021. During this time, VAERS received 2,794 reports of death (0.00167%) among people who received a COVID-19 vaccine. CDC and FDA physicians review each case report of death as soon as notified and CDC requests medical records to further assess reports. A review of available clinical information including death certificates, autopsy, and medical records revealed no evidence that vaccination contributed to patient deaths. CDC and FDA will continue to investigate reports of adverse events, including deaths, reported to VAERS."
My source:
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/safety/adverse-events.html
"A review of available clinical information including death certificates, autopsy, and medical records revealed no evidence that vaccination contributed to patient deaths."
So the CDC is only passively "investigating". If no one orders an autopsy then there is nothing for the CDC to examine.
I myself have decided not to get the vaccine. I plan on emailing my principal soon to rescind my medical accommodation.
However my main motivation for returning w/o vaccine is
1. I'm concerned about possible effects down the road. For eg prior animal studies on coronavirus vaccines found that vaccination actually caused more serious infection in the future. Fauci has brought up these studies himself.
2. We now know that COVID is not nearly as deadly as we originally thought. That risk is acceptable to me.
Whether or not someone wants the vaccine is their choice. Whatever happened to my body, my choice?
Regardless of vax status, I think that we all need to go back to work. Though if someone wants to continue milking their accommodation, then I guess that is their prerogative.
James writes,
"We can probably drastically cut down on future deaths by being vigilant a while longer but we more than likely won't because of selfishness."
We can probably increase the GDP and reduce future deaths if we all buy new cell phones but we more than likely won't because of frugality.
Wouldn't pass mustard in any logic or debate class you taught at Jamaica, James.
I don't get your comparison Shelley. Being vigilant to save lives is more important than the growth rate of the GDP. Scientists are warning of dangers of reopening too soon.
5:11: Seniority right? What are those?
NYTimes today:
2021
United States coronavirus cases have increased again after hitting a low point late last month, and some of the states driving the upward trend have also been hit hardest by variants, according to an analysis of data from Helix, a lab testing company.
The country’s vaccine rollout has sped up since the first doses were administered in December, recently reaching a rolling average of more than three million doses per day. And new U.S. cases trended steeply downward in the first quarter of the year, falling by almost 80 percent from mid-January through the end of March.
But during that period, states also rolled back virus control measures, and now mobility data shows a rise in people socializing and traveling. Amid all this, more-contagious variants have been gaining a foothold, and new cases are almost 20 percent higher than they were at the lowest point in March.
“It is a pretty complex situation, because behavior is changing, but you’ve also got this change in the virus itself at the same time,” said Emily Martin, an epidemiologist at the University of Michigan School of Public Health.
https://noqreport.com/2021/04/04/number-of-covid-vaccine-injuries-reported-to-vaers-surpasses-50000-cdc-data-show/
James why would you give your teenager a vaccine that has 99.9% survival with no idea of the long term effects it could have in the future? It would be one thing if it's been 2 years with no science or data to show otherwise then I can see as a parent doing that.
With covid passports, baseball-only allowing vaccinated people, our rights are being stripped away. Just like cancel culture takes away anyone with an R next to it.
Speaking of MLB (BLM backwards) they can go to hell for ridiculous movement of the all-star game.
Interesting how the website you sent me to ignores the part where the CDC reports, "A review of available clinical information including death certificates, autopsy, and medical records revealed no evidence that vaccination contributed to patient deaths."
Long term studies are kind of hard to do when COVID has only been around since 2019.
I think we will do a posting on COVID passports. We have vaccination mandates before kids can go to school.
As for vaccinating my kids and me, I will trust our doctors and not some right wing website.
' According to the CDC’s website, “the CDC follows up on any report of death to request additional information and learn more about what occurred and to determine whether the death was a result of the vaccine or unrelated.” '
' Although the CDC and U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA) have various systems in place to monitor the safety of vaccines, they are not “up and running” and do not have adequate resources behind them, Kesselheim said. '
It seems they acknowledge what you are saying James.
I think the issue is they were unprepared for and unable to keep up with all the reports being generated. Think about how many reports they get in a normal year. And are used to monitoring.
All of a sudden they are getting so many reports that their computer system literally can't keep up. How could they possibly have the manpower to investigate each claim?
Ignoring the crazy conspiracy theories, it's reasonable to not trust them to be on top of this. Like you said, no bad faith, but hiring enough people to take care of this isn't easy.
Anon2323 and others don’t have to justify shit. Their body. Their choice. Abortion rights advocates best beware. If the courts force vaccinate,the pro lifers will have precedents to run to court with. I’m vaccinated and for selfish reasons I’d like everyone to be vaccinated because vaccinated people don’t spread the virus but I 100% support those who do not want this new vaccine that so far only has emergency approval. The CDC along with the NYT has lost their credibility. So what they say is no more important than what anyone says. I still took the damn vaccine. My body. My choice. Btw “conspiracy theory” is now just another overused buzzword like “experts” and “racist” . It means nothing anymore. You can thank the fake news for this mess. Whatever their agenda is, it’s not to objectively give us facts. No one trusts them anymore either so the more they push for masks and vaccines the more resistant people become.
They are talking vaccine passports which let you board a plane or enter a building. It's coming whether right wing nut jobs like it or not. Instead of conspiracy theory, can we still use Commie plot?
Naomi Wolf has been pushing against vaccine passports and government overreach in general. Of course after her recent interview on Tucker, Wikipedia threw "conspiracy theorist" into the second sentence of her bio. Facebook blocked her last night. Can't have anyone speaking out against the authoritative sources.
At least for now the DOE isn't requiring vaccines. Once they do we all have to stand up against them, actually act like a union. Since the vaccine is near 100% effective against severe disease, those who are afraid to be around the unvaccinated (who will eventually have natural immunity if they don't already) can just get the vaccine. Personal choice. Why should the DOE be able to violate the sovereignty of our bodies.
1252. Countries are using them to avoid vaccinated people needing to be tested and quarantined when traveling. It's not that wild really, though i imagine there will be, as they say, "legal challenges." As far as entering buildings, sounds like a decision for the private sector and business owners. They make their own rules.
And i suppose you can use Commie plot when the US becomes a Communist government, but until then it is a Capitalist plot here.
134 Definitely agree with the sovereignty of one's own body, but yet vaccinations are already a requirement for schools and universities. These vaccines of course will wear off like the flu shot.. then what? Require an annual vaccine? None of the current vaccine requirements are annual ones. A lot of nuance here to be fiddled with.
313 typical lefty thinking he needs to clear his word choice with the group think tank. You can use whatever words you like, dear. But if you use the words expert, racist, or conspiracy theory no one take you seriously anymore. There will be no involuntary passports no matter how hard you freedom haters try.
4:12 how do you suggest we fight back against dictator cuomos excelsior pass? I'm all ears.
I'll take my money to neighboring states if NY businesses insist on it, I'm already doing that anyway, but what if they say we need it to get in to school? If it's just a few people here and there then they can try to fire us. Similarly how they said teachers who do not consent to covid testing will be put on unpaid leave. That's why we need to stick together, but based on the way teachers have not stuck together over the past year + how many people treat what "the experts" say as gospel, I'm not optimistic.
3:18 Part of the reason certain vaccines are required are because those diseases are more dangerous than covid and have been effectively eradicated in the US. Not possible with something like covid or the flu, virus mutates too often.
Also, currently mandated vaccines have years of safety data available. Covid vaccines are EUA only and have no long-term safety data. If you trust big Pharma then great, get it. I don't and am more than happy to go back to work w/o their vaccine.
Right wingnuts are really afraid of COVID passports. I would favor mandatory vaccines to work next year just to see you freedom lovers forced onto unpaid leaves.
First they'll require the passports for you to get in to businesses. So much for freedom of movement.
In Israel, months after instituting their Green Pass, they are already threatening to revoke the passport of parents who do not get their kids vaccinated. What if I don't want my child to get an experimental vaccine with no long term safety data, when their risk from covid is minimal.
246 0-17 year old have died from covid
https://www.statista.com/statistics/1191568/reported-deaths-from-covid-by-age-us/
Like James pointed out earlier, another 1000 or so have gotten a dangerous inflammatory condition.
And what will their passport lead to next? Years or decades down the line? Govt programs don't just go away. They're only expanded. In ways not originally imaginable.
Naomi Wolf, lifelong democrat, not exactly a "right wingnut", understands what's going on. If you're curious why don't you check her out and evaluate another perspective, before she's removed from the rest of the major platforms, instead of imaging how nice it would be for your coworkers to get forced on unpaid leaves.
412 huh? I like the word coherency.
441 Yup. I actually don't see this becoming mandated. Most especially because I do think this currently free of charge vaccine will eventually come at a cost in some way. I don't see big pharma willing to produce enough free of charge vaccinations annually to cover school children and staff.
6:18 There's no such thing as a free lunch. The govt paid billions for the doses themselves, and paid billions more to support their development in the first place.
Govt, not big Pharma, will also pay for any and all damages proven to be caused by vaccines.
https://www.hrsa.gov/vaccine-compensation/index.html
As if that wasn't enough, Pfizer is already talking about raising covid vaccine prices.
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/pfizer-covid-vaccine-price-hike-post-pandemic/
Crony capitalism at its finest. If I had to bet on it I'd predict mandated annual vaccines, for the sake of big Pharma.
653. Agreed, in one way or another we are drained to prop up this system. Government money being our money. I was referring to out of pocket charges. Interesting twist you propose there, mandating it to add to big Pharma profits. I don't see it really happening though, but when you put it that way it wouldn't be too surprising.
Enjoying this convo. @4:46 eat a fat dick. Meanwhile, the left pushes for your body your choice as a major abortion weapon. Typical double standard self-hating hypocrite.
https://nypost.com/2021/04/06/246-fully-vaccinated-michigan-residents-get-covid-3-die-report/
Let's give this vaccine to kids who have 99.999% SURVIVAL with little to no effects.
Businesses requiring vaccine passports will host lefties while businesses that don’t will host righties. The free market will determine who stays in business. I’m vaccinated but I’m not signing up for any passport. I can socialize and have fun without showing my papers. Few years away from relocating to Florida the land of the free so if I have to skip some venues between now and then it’ll just mean I’ll have more money to spend in Florida rather than NY. Too many of you are willing to let us be stripped of rights. Not on board with it even though I chose to get vaccinated.
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